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97 thoughts on “Video Blog: The Biggest Weakness Of The New Star Trek”

  1. I see your point on Nero. They really needed a scene where he destroys the star that overtook romulus since he went back in time and had control of the red matter. I think that should have been priority #1 for the romulans: to complete the mission that spock was late in accomplishing. Still liked Nero. Like you, I think it just needed polish to make his vendetta believable.

    My big problem was actually having Kirk go from a cadet on acedemic probation to the captian of the newest and best ship in starfleet with no years of experience under his belt. He should have just gotten a decoration at the end and maybe in the next movie he could work his way up from a frigate or destroyer to the Enterprise.

  2. I agree with this review. I went to the British Premier in Leicester Sqr and was pumped up. Put it this way. My girlfriend said she loved it. So I knew my feelings of disapoinment of a lax story line but great character introduction was not wrong. 7/10. The sequel will kick ass I know that much.

  3. Wow John thanks, you kinda opened my eyes, I didn’t really think about all the things you said when I watched the movie. The movie is still great no doubt, but yea you def. make good points! Hmm I guess thats the beauty of movies though,they all have their should of’s, would of’s,& could of’s.

    1. PS: the romance between Uhura and Spock was sure something, it was unexpected[for me at least] but it was alright i didnt mind it all at,.. =] aww who knew Spock and Uhura, but still I just kept thinking, hmm i guess in this timeline there is no Spock and Nurse Chapel.

    1. If they told people 100 years in advance that Katrina was going to flood half of New Orleans, they sure could have done something about it.

      I think the issue would have been more “if they believed him” If they dropped a line saying he tried that and was rejected as some doomsday lunatic, then fine, but he didn’t even try. Or even leave a message to be opened at a later date so that his family and loved ones could “be off world” at the time just in case. He made no effort at all.

      Of course all this speculation doesn’t mean he wouldn’t have tried to address this later after his personal vendetta against Spock was resolved. He still had a long time to warn them while he waited for Spock, and would have even longer after that happened too.

  5. it was good, he was okay, after all he was not in his right mind. Suffering such a loss he was unable to handle it and was not thinking straight. All he wanted was revenge. Sure he could have gone back and warned everyone, to get ready for the supernova, but then what kind of movie will that have made? all in all it was good.

  6. In origin movies the villains often suffer.

    I agree with you John on Nero’s motivations. I have read the prequel comics and still question his motivation.

    However in order to properly flesh out Nero the movie would have had to been a half an hour longer. This is one area where the writer’s strike obviously affected the overall story.

  7. Hey John, just a thought. I hope my grasp of the movie is sound (sometimes I need multiple viewings to understand things). Don’t know if anyone else has postulated this (too many comments to read), so here it goes.

    As far as point 2 is concerned, Nero would’ve known that even if he had warned the Romulans, it wouldn’t change the fact that he would never see his wife again. I don’t know what the life span of a Romulan is, but over 100 years in the future, he would more than likely die of old age before he would see his wife being born. That may explain his rage. I know I would be pissed if I just realized I had gone back in time, but was still unable to see my wife again.

    Am I wrong, or did he not have the ability to travel in time cart blanch, he just had the single time travel event in the beginning, so he couldn’t travel in to the future and take care of it that way.

  8. I think your simply nit-picking John. I understand you don’t feel that Nero was a weak villain. However, did this really need to be said? Why knock such a great movie? Why not just leave it at Nero could of been a better villain?

    IMO I thought Nero was good. I got that he was just pissed that he lost his wife and lost his home and needed someone to blame. So he blamed Spock and the Federation because they had the means to save them but failed. Why is that a plot hole? Also, He wasn’t always evil. He was driven to this because of what happened. I thought he was as sinister as he needed to be. He was trying to destroy all the planets in the Federation. That’s pretty evil to me.

    About why he didn’t simply call and warn Romulus about the coming disaster. I don’t know. But if I were to say I was from the future and that the sun was going to supernova in 100 years, we need to find a way to stop it. Would you or anyone believe me? Nope.

    He simply was doing what he thought was needed to be done to save Romulus and that was to separate Romulus from the Federation. His anger blinded him from more “peaceful” ways to save it. But he was seeking revenge on the ones who failed while trying to save his family and home planet.

    Like I said. I think your simply nit-picking because you need to. Some people need to find flaws and somepeople focus on those flaws. No matter how small they are. There are even people who allow such flaws to completely ruin the entire movie for them. Maybe I’m just one of the lucky ones who can let minor things slide and not hone in and dwell on it to much.

    If anything I thought was the biggest flaw of the movie. It would be why a big fur less bright red monster existed on a what appeared to be a “Hoth” like planet. Simply does not make sense.

  9. I agree that instead of going around and destroying every other planet in the galaxy, he could focus on saving his own, and THEN maybe getting revenge on old-man spock. That didn’t make a whole lot of sense.

    But I think I was fine with the villain being just a prop though. For me and for my girlfriend, we’re not very familiar with the Star Trek universe and characters, so we preferred the focus to be on the heroes since we didn’t know them that well yet. But even one line of dialogue from Spock or whoever giving just that little bit more motivation to Bana would have helped.

    I think I just assumed Romulans were weird and had overblown emotions which keep them from thinking logically. Even if they’re just humans with tattoos, Romulans are ‘alien’, so i figured there’d be some fundamental difference between how Eric Bana would deal with grief. 25 year sustained Viking beserker rage or whatever. I think the film could have just said that he’s gone nuts and not thinking logically, and that would helped things.

    Either way I still loved the film.

  11. Another insightful, eloquent and well thought out post from BigSampson.

    By an large I agree with you John, and most of the time something like this would be a show stopper for me. In this case though, I just kind of forgave it. Kind of a “well he has his reasons I’m sure” kind of thing, and just got on with enjoying the movie.

  14. John! Excellent, excellent video post! Things like this are why I LOVE TMB.

    But here’s my take…

    The points you make don’t really matter for the average moviegoer. I wasn’t all that distracted by the villains motivations not really being all that realistic (until I saw your post).

    However, I do think that everything you said in your video would be perfect for a film study course! I agree with everything you said, and for a budding filmmaker (I’m not one of them), the points you bring up are really important. I think you need to get started on writing a textbook.

    Also, I agree that with this Startrek prequel (or any movie for that matter), I don’t think the audience should have to read a prequel comic to understand the movie. Nor do I think that they should have in depth knowledge of all the different intricacies of the Startrek Universe. Everything that the general audience needs to enjoy the movie should be in the… MOVIE!

    All I think that the general audience should have been expected of knowing were some minor details of who main characters were. I think it was the responsibility of the movie makers in showing the audience the rest (and I think they did an EXCELLENT job in that).

  15. Honestly, the biggest beef *I* had with the flick was Old Spock.

    Now hear me out. I LOVED this flick overall, but the time travel thing just put a bit of a damper on it for me.

    I don’t think Kirk earned his chair. I think Old Spock manipulated circumstances to get him there… “just because”… whether or not the Kirk of this timeline had actually earned it. Remember, Kirk 1.0 was a bit of a rebel, but he also worked his way up the food chain. Kirk 2.0 got his chair through a series of time altered coincidences.

    The time travel thing… as cool as it was to see Nimoy as Spock again… it pulled me out of the movie and I honestly think that with a few tweaks to the plot, it would’ve been unnecessary.

    The story was strong enough on its own without having to bring in all the baggage of a 40 year continuity. If the point of this flick was to start fresh, then start 100% fresh.

    Bringing Old Spock in for the sake of pleasing fandom made as much sense as shoehorning Michael Keaton or Adam West into The Dark Knight.

    Nero… Nero reminded me of the Picard clone villian from Nemesis, and I questioned why they stuck in another bitter Romulan character in a flick that was supposed to cleanse the palette. Go figure.

    Here’s hoping that time travel is never mentioned again from here on out, and that the sequel will let this new timeline stand on its own merits.

  16. I kind of wonder if the movie would’ve actually been stronger if they hadn’t put a face to the villain and just had this big menacing ship attacking the federation.

  17. John thank you!!!! I love you so much!! (In a totally hetero way.) A man that losses his home planet and wife AND everything that he holds dear travels back in time and does nothing prevent it. I’m going to be the first (I think the first I haven’t read all the comments) and say… I didn’t like the movie all that much. Don’t get me wrong I’m glad that they rebooted the series and performances were great. However a Star Trek movie should be smarter than this. It was just another action that should be forgotten in a couple of months.

  18. why is never ever someone talking about the MOVIE? you didn’t like this or that in the story…? so fucking what, you moron?
    that’s the problem of the story, the screenplay, whatever… has nothing to do with the MOVIE. the movie consists of images (are they good?), of music (is it good?), the editing (same) and so on.

    1. Hey Lars,

      I’m sorry… I MUST be misunderstanding you. Are you suggesting that the STORY and the SCREENPLAY have NOTHING to do with the movie?

      Because, you can’t be suggesting that. Tell me you just said that wrong.

  19. It is a shame. They did a great job of re-inventing the crew and their motivations for a 2009 film audience but the bad guy was actually the same old bad guy cliché scenario from the past we’ve seen over and over. It wasn’t re-invented at all, unlike how Joker and all he stands for was so effectively in Batman.

    The whole time travel element to the script to me was a cop out and shows that the writer doesn’t have a huge amount of knowledge of the SF genre and its possibilities, much like with Lost – he knows character, but plot is a mess. But even Nero’s character was threadbare. That whole “Hi Christopher, It’s Nero” thing with an American accent was bizarre.

    BTW I think it’s perfectly fair to nitpick a film that could have been spot on but just didn’t quite make it rather than mulling over some total mess like Wolverine, which just isn’t worth the effort. The nearly ran’s are the ones worth fighting for.

  20. In regards to point 1, I think you may need to se the film again. My understanding is that he is an INSANE ROMULAN, and that is why he is so angry. Also, I think the reason he blamed the Federation, and I might be off base on this, is not because he just thought that Spock wasn’t able to save his planet, but I also think he thought Spock was THE REASON his planet was blown up (as in Spock DID IT, not just couldn’t prevent it). Like I said, I might be off on that, but that was my interpretation.

    As for point 2 of your argument. Well said.

  21. Greetings,

    ( btw, Love the rules pre-posted in the box)
    I agree with you 100% but also think he was still a good villain because I think the focus was on the reboot of the main protagonists.The devil is in the details! Any story using time travel we have to let use suspension of disbelief.
    There is only one good villain in Trek and we know who that is.( last name starts with K )
    Thank for the post and the site, I miss the daily movie blog but still a big fan, Thanks!

  22. John I liked your review, I agree with most things you say but…… Nero did lose his wife in that catastrophe. He may have had 100 years to fix this by traveling to Romulus and giving them this warning, but he would be long dead before he ever saw his wife. So his grief cannot be fixed and his anger is still misplaced no matter what.

    I think this movie did an outstanding job of introducing Chris Pine as the new Kirk and Quinto as Spock, Karl Urban was also outstanding as Bones! I tried not to get hung up on the storyline as much as enjoying the re-introduction of the characters.

    You do realize how hard it was for Chris Pine to follow in William Shatners monstrous footsteps?

    1. wtf u mean william shatner sucks at acting so hardcore it hurts….why the fuck would u want to follow his lead…it would mean utter fail if he did

    2. Just cause you think Shatner sucks doesnt make it so. There were a lot of expectations for Pine to live up to, If you would have read Mens Health where Chris Pine is featured he talks about this agonizing decision to play Kirk and the expectations he was faced with.

      Shatner has received 3 Emmy’s and also a Golden Globe for his work on Boston Leagal. So maybe do some research before you throw your trash.

      Like it or not Shatner is a Cultural Icon, not me saying it, its just a fact.

      peace out

  23. John, this maybe beating a dead horse but, think of the comics as easter eggs. Something that if you make the effort (in this case read, invest in comics and blah, blah) you’re rewarded with tokens for the cluebus. Like you I didn’t read the comic and I’ve been collecting for nearly fifty years. I’m gong to make sure to pick up the TPB if I can’t get the copies. Rambling but, i just agree on the marketing..

  24. I agree with John! The problem with Nero is that his back-story from Countdown(the prequel comics) is not shown in the movie. I understand that JJ Abrams was walking a tight rope and couldn’t spend screen time tying his film to the existing Star Trek universe. However, Nero suffered as a villain because of that. As a trekie I had no problem with reading the comics prior to seeing the film. As a casual movie goer Nero comes off as confusing and one dimensional. From what I have read Countdown is considered to be the first 45 minuets of the movie. Perhaps when the DVD comes out they will do an Ultimate release with Countdown as part of the movie.

  25. I agree with you John. The only thing that could explain Nero’s anger towards the federation, (without use of the comicbook) would be the disdain that Romulans already had towards the federation. In the previous series the Romulans, weren’t all that friendly with the Federation and readily jumped ship when the Dominion offered them a deal back in DS9.

    That being said, I do realize my argument is a bit reaching and I’m making up for the filmmakers laziness in making a better reason. This Star Trek was supposed to be for people that weren’t Trekkies before the film and so, they should have made sure to close that they didn’t leave the hole in there script that they did.

  26. When was there last a great and memorable villain in an action movie? Movies today simply toss any one dimensional villain with weak motivations out there and hope moviegoers will be distracted enough by the special effects too notice.

        1. i agree….mu opinion was that nero was a fine villian….he is pissed his wife died nuff said….john i think you are dweeling so hard on it just to knock it for discussion reasons.

          1. Hey BigSampson,

            Wrong. I’m fine that he was pissed that his wife died. But why did he blame Spock and the federation? Why not just kill his own crew if he was so pissed?

            And why did he do nothing to try to save his planet now that he was in the past?

            If you think those issues are just “dwelling”, then… wow.

  27. John, you’re absolutely right. And I think I know why we feel this way.

    According to what I read, there was a whole sub plot of the movie that was taken out of the final cut regarding Nero (I think I read this over at IGN, or maybe filmjunk.com…not sure). Apparently he wasn’t just sitting around for 25 years. Rather, he and his crew ended up somehow in a horrible prison for a long time. There was a whole sub plot about Nero being in this prison, and how he and his crew escaped.

    Also this explains why half of one of Nero’s ears was mangled/cut off in the later scenes (I didn’t notice this when I saw it but others did). I think he lost the ear while in the prison or during the escape or something.

    Perhaps if they left this part of the movie in, it would’ve helped flesh out Nero’s motivation, and we wouldn’t be thinking how lame of a villain he is – or it could’ve ruined the flow of the film (which is why I assume they cut it).

    – Keith

    1. That is logical. If you recall, Ohura, when talking to the Orian girl, mentions that she had monitored a call reffering to a prison break. A friend of mine states that Nero was on Rura Penthe, the prison that would appear in STAR TREK VI. Then, a Romulan vessel destroyed a Klingon convoy.

  28. Also, lets say Spock did succeed in putting the black hole in the supernova – then that leaves what energy source for the Romulan planet?

    If our sun suddenly disappeared, our planet would be a frozen wasteland. So Nero not warning his planet of its demise makes even less sense.

    Or am I just being nitpicky?

  29. I agree completely… The point you raise about Nero is very hard to understand within the context of the movie. We shouldn’t need comic books to complete the story.

    The one thing that took me out of the movie was the ‘coincidence’ of Kirk coming upon Spock’s cave… but whatever, I enjoyed the movie for what it was.

  30. John!!! Dude…Nero was INSANE. IN-fucking-SANE. Did the Joker need a reason to be so nuts in The Dark Knight? Why didn’t you go on and on and on about HIS motivation in destroying Gotham??

    People like that who as as crazy as cat shit don’t need a reason. The smallest thing sets them off. Besides, Nero was an ALIEN. He wasn’t human. Why try and rationalize his motivation from a human perspective? Maybe Romulans work differently in the sense that if you say you’re gonna do something and fuck it up and drop the ball..then there’s NO forgiveness.

    Also..yes Nero could have gone and warned Romulus. But perhaps he knew that instead of saving their world, the Romulan government would just try and take his ship and destroy the Federation. Also, warning his planet in the past doesn’t give him his wife back in the present. The OLD him would have it..but he wouldn’t.

    Yes, you are right..MAJOR plot holes. And we shouldn’t have to go to a comic to get the rest of the story. Although it IS a good marketing scheme….make those who REALLY care go buy something else so they make more money.

    1. Wait a second here? Your making the argument that Nero was insane but then your making the statement that he doesnt feel the same way as humans because hes not human?

      That makes no sense. Here is why, first of all Nero is a humanoid. He looks human and acts such as huamans do when in certain situations happen. His wife dies and he wants revenge thats what most humans feel. Second of all being Nero wasnt insane as the Joker. Joker was insane because he has an alternate perception of the world. He has no limits because he doesnt follow the worlds rules. Joker doent seen whats right and wrong. Nero however felt that the death of his wife was wrong so others should be punished. It just didnt make sense that he went after the federation instead of just Spock. Thats like Kahn destroying the federation instead of searching for Kirk.

  31. Why is John complaining about a villian ? Eric Bana plays a green man with tatoo’s on his bloody head. He screams ”FIRE EVERYTHING” and everything does get fired. John ,if you have to complain about Star Trek , than complain why Zachary Quinto doesnt know how to do a Star Trek greet and glues his bloody fingers together. Villians are Villians, they suck and nobody cares how evil they suck. For the next Star Trek we will place Topher Grace as Venom, lets see if he sucks too.

  35. john

    i was under the belief that the minute he went into the black hole and attacked that starship he caused an alternate timeline, so if we went to Romulus and told them about the supernova he would’nt really be preventing his own future from happening.

    i guess unless he cared about his people surviving no matter what timeline it was

    also, do you think remakes can become classics like you said star trek almost was?

    1. i agree with steven. and i hear you john. but i thought it was clear he couldn’t have changed what happend for him. another him yes. but not him in his timeline. selfish guy, villian, makes sense to me.

  36. ur right John, i never thot of it that way. but it doesnt ruin the movie for me. Nero is just arrogant. hes made this big quest to avenge his planet, and he doesnt want to be proven wrong. hes not gonna say “oh, right! well, lets just go save ramulan. sorry to bother you!”

  37. While I agree with your first notion, about Nero’s lack of proper motive for attackign the federation here in this film. The second one, the one I see a lot of, is very flawed.

    Here’s a guy who’s tried to warn the Romulan empire of impending doom weeks before it even happens. They don’t believe him that it is that serious. Now he goes back in time, unwillingly mind you, and you expect him to go tell the Romulan empire that something is going to happen years in the future? They would laugh him out of the senate chamber! He’s mad with grief, not stupid!

  38. I kind of wish the music was better in it too. It was good, but music has been a big part of Star Trek, and it didn’t quite reach level of quality that Goldsmith, Horner, and even Eidelman were able to achieve.

  39. How about the simple fact that the Romulan star went Nova! I mean, stars don’t just go Nova without quite a bit of warning (like decades, maybe even centuries worth of data like spectra shifts as the hydrogen fuel is spent). Also, even if Spock did get a black hole in place in time, Romulus was a dead world. No sun, no heat, and I highly doubt that the Romulans had the infrastructure to either evacuate the planet, or dig in and survive for an extended time. Millions, billions, would still die with no guarantee that the wife of a mining ship captain would survive.

  40. just off the top of my head it doesnt seem like any of these reboots/origin stories are intended to have great villains. examples: this movie, batman begins, even like the first spiderman movie. they all seem to save their really good villains for the second movie, because the first one introduces us into the world and to the characters we will be sticking with. even like with iron man or transformers(probably shouldnt even mention tformers cause that movie is much worse than others) the villains arent major parts of the movie, or they only come into play towards the last third of the story.

    3. i disagree, I think it just a result of lazy writiing and the fact that when your outed for writing a major character in a movie that writter makes a bigger effort to make the sequels villian better and impressionable. I also think calling transformers a much worse movie is unfair. Sure is wasnt all that great but the villians didnt just all show up in the end. You did get to see Blackout, Frenzy and Barracade in the first half of the movie.

  42. I hate this lazy way of connecting the dots within in movies by having a pre-released comic or animated story to prep you for a movie, it’s bullshit. Sure, the animated projects might be cool, but for the average viewer who is not in the know should be able to go into a movie and enjoy the experience without scratching their heads at certain plot holes. A movie, a good one, stands on its own. I do think Star Trek is a good sci-fi/adventure movie, but I found it lacking that Trek spirit of storytelling and while I was thoroughly entertained I didn’t love the movie. I’ve have mixed feelings on the flick all week, but despite all the little things that bothered me I can say I did like the movie.

    On the flipside my daughter loved the movie, she’s a non-Trek fan, the target audience to bring in a new crowd and revive the franchise.

    Oh and John – I agree with your opinion completely. :)

  43. I’d like to see JJ Abrams answer these questions…. In all serioousnedss I think you should ring his management or whatever and try to get an interview…. It would be awsome to see JJ on the Movie blog answering Johns Questions.

  44. Agreed.

    You’re right.

    There are fundamentals in film storytelling. When they’re there, things shine. When they’re not… : (

    A strong villain and everything that goes along with it, is one of these fundamentals.

    This film to me, was like the second Daniel Craig Bond film, ‘A Quantum of Solace’, in that everything served the notion of it being a reboot. And also like that film, I loved this one DESPITE its flaws. Such as the ones you’ve so capably brought up.

    It’s like being enraptured about someone: when you’re in that head/heart-space, the shortcomings just…don’t…matter.

  45. To tell everybody the truth, I didn’t even notice her character in the movie. i went to IMDb to look at the cast/production ppl and saw Ryder was in the movie and didn’t even see her in the movie…. so can some one tell me who she played/what scene ?

    Thanks

    1. She is Spock’s Mom. The scene where he goes back to save the council in his planet. She is the one that Falls and dies. I didn’t even notice it was her until i hear people talking smack about her.

    2. Which is why there was nothing wrong with her. If an actor buries themselves in a role so well, they have done a great job. As it is, Ryder was in the film for only a few minutes, hardly enough to be a weak link.

  46. I do think there was quite a bit of footage that was cut from the film so who knows if they filmed any explanation. The last shot of the first full length trailer features Nero in shabby clothes saying “the wait is over”. That scene is nowhere to be found in the finished film.

    My main problem with Nero was that he didn’t even get a great send off, a great death scene. He just kinda poofed and vanished.

  47. Nero’s logic is flawed. Destroying every planet in the Federation won’t stop Romulus’ star from going supernova 125 years later. Yes, a “Romulus without the federation.” Ok. Got it. That means they won’t have the federation 125 years later to even warn them that their sun is about to supernova. Or am I missing summat?

    Still loved the film. I’ll be seeing it on the IMAX machine this weekend…

  48. I feel that what they were trying to do was introduce all the characters again. They spent a little too much time introducing and not enough on developing Nero’s story. To me this is what happen with Transformers (which I love) they spent too much time on the humans and not enough with the Robots. I still think the movie was great.

    2. My guess is it’s because she is a recognizable actress, who people don’t have much respect for… even when she does a good job in a Star Trek movie.

    3. again we agree. she was absolutely fine. the only reason anyone is singling her out is because of who she is and not the actual job she did.

      which was fine. if she was an unknown no one would be commenting on it.

    4. I did think her old lady voice was distracting bcit was the same voice from when she played the old version of herself in edward scissor hands…”Before him it never snowed, but now it does” — or something like that.

  51. I agree with you John that the villain was a weak point in the movie, more so for since you enjoyed the movie much much more than I did.

    I unfortunately found the movie flawed as a whole and the villain was just one of many issues for me. I found no Gravitas in the movie at all, and that includes Nero as the new villain. And you are right his motivation though misplaced as you said, I could kind of accept. But I do agree that in that span of 25 years when he could have done something to prevent it…yeah that bothered me through the whole movie.

    But I did not read the comic and neither did you as many people have pointed out. But I still think you should not have to read the comic to fill in pieces the movie does not elaborate on. The movie should be self contained with the comic just providing additional information.

    1. The problem overall I see, and maybe John can voice an opinion about this as a whole, is movie studios are getting more into the concept of using other forms of media as a prequel to their movie.

      There have already been prequel DVDs, usually animated, of live action movies, like they did one for Van Helsing when that came out. It seems though the popular form right now is either book or comic mini series. The first Transformers movie actually had both and ROTF has 2 comic prequels and one book, and GI JOE already has one comic prequel I know of, plus of course Star Trek and I think others to come as well.

      John is right, and movies need to stand on their own, but when you have such “fascinating” back stories in the comics and books that tie directly into the upcoming movie, how to get that out to the most people?

  52. So let me get this straight…
    .
    Nero KNEW for WEEKS that his sun was doomed.
    .
    And it would only take SECONDS to beam his wife off the planet…
    .
    Nero is an idiot.

    1. The comic has it where Spock convinces Nero to come with him to Vulcan and promises he will be back in time to get his wife off planet. Because the Vulcan Elders keep stalling, etc, and Spock is not much help here; Nero leaves Vulcan too late to get back to Romulus in time

    1. I dont think so because Kahn as a villan had evolved from who he was in the tv series to who he was in the movie. Also to note that the movie was subtitled “The Wrath of Kahn” there should have been a dame good reason for Kahn to want revenge. It was a great story and still my favorite Star Trek film. I never was intrested in Nero much like the villan from Nemisis. I thought it would have been better to bring in the Dominion seeing how they lost to the federation. But at least filling in the plot holes would give fans less to bitch about.

  54. Star Trek was very holey in terms of plot, but still good fun. Agreed, but suspend your disbelief. How many times has someone ‘reversed the polarity of the neutron flow’ in regular Star Trek? ;)

    1. Someone made that as a joke one time. According to star trek if you ever need to fix something all you have to do is reverse the polarity.

      You are right though. my biggest question about the movie was when they went to blow up the drill, how did they plan to get off? It would blow up while they were on it since they couldn’t get off of it until it was blown up.

  55. Putting a better villain in the movie would make it one of the all-time “great, sci-fi, classics” of all time?

    Not the lack of a really great science idea or something to ponder, but the lack of an angry villain?

    This is actually funny – it occurred to me just yesterday actually that all of my favorite Star Trek episodes didn’t even have a villain. The best ST episode (for me) involved some sort of scientific or internal character dilemma.

    I do the Borg, The Klingons, Q, etc – don’t get me wrong.
    But some of my favorite episodes (The one where the Enterprise explodes and everyone dies at the very beginning of the show, the one where Picard spends an entire lifetime as a peasant on a planet, holo-deck issues, the addictive game episode, Spock going into heat, etc). Those are the really interesting, fun episodes. A bigger, badder villain with more explosions and laser tag would not make this movie “a classic, all-time great” sci-fi movie. It might make it a classic, action/adventure movie, but not sci-fi.

    1. Andrew, you’re missing the point man.

      This was a Sci-Fi action/adventure movie. And as such, yes, it required a great solid villain.

      Now, if they made a totally different kind of Star Trek movie, then yes, the need for a great solid villain gets reduced, I agree with you completely… but this is the movie they made, and as such would have been a lot better with a solid villain.

      And yes, I think this movie was good enough that if it added a villain like Vader or Khan or Hans Gruber… then it would have been considered one of the all time great Sci-Fi movies.

      Nero had great potential to be up there… but they wasted him IMO

    2. I agree with Andrew about the best episodes. My favorite one of all time was when Picard lived an entire lifetime in a matter of minutes when they encountered a “strange satellite.” The one where he ends up with the flute.

      However, John is also right when it comes to the action/adventure aspect. Nero didn’t rise to the level of Khan or the Borg Queen in the movie (haven’t read the prequel comics).

      God, I’m sounding like a politician because I’m agreeing with both of you.

      I loved this movie though… it sits right up there with Wrath of Khan and First Contact, even with out a villain that was fully realized on film.

      My suggestion would be to shoot the comic prequel as a bonus for the DVD… how frigging great would that be!

  56. Totally on the mark John. My wife and I both said nearly the same thing after seeing the film. Still it was a great movie, better than I expected. It helped to forget about all the things they could have done right with Wolverine (though I’m excited that Deadpool/Ryan Reynolds is getting his own flick!)

  57. John

    I posted this in your review of Star Trek, but you REALLY REALLY need to read Star Trek: Countdown, by IDW. It does explain Nero’s motivation and why he is angry with Spock as well as the Federation, as the comic series had Picard, ambassador to Vulcan, Data, captain of the Enterprise, Geordi, who actually built Spock’s ship!, and Worf, now a general with the Klingon fleet.

    Spock, Picard and Data stalled Nero on Vulcan over and over until it was too late to go save his wife, as Spock thought the Vulcans and the Federation would help save Romulus but they feared the Red Matter from being revealed to their enemies. The only reason they chose to use it was the supernova was going to get worse and affect the Federation, so basically they were looking out for themselves. They also kind of leave out that Nero’s ship is part BORG in the movie too!

    I agree with your point #2 though. I mean he could have gone to Romulus, warned them, and then come back to wail on Spock. However, he blames the Romulan government for this disaster too, since Spock warned them weeks in advance that Vulcan scientists detected the problem in the sun, and they refused to listen or evacuate the planet in time

    1. Hey Bill,

      I see what you’re saying… but the prequel comic is not the movie. The movie has to be able to stand on it’s own and give all the needed information and details. I went to see the movie, and these were the glaring weaknesses of the movie IMO.

    2. thats exactly right. you shouldn’t have to read a prequel comic or watch some webisode to understand a film or tv show.

      but one thing about warning romulus – would anytone believe him?

      what would you call someone who shows up claiming to be from the future warning you the world is going to end in 150 years time???

    3. On #2, you know I agree with you 100% percent.

      BIN

      As for the prequel comic.
      You say Data is the Captain of The Enterprise? Did the comic explain how? Data… died, didn’t he?

      Geodi La Forge built Spock’s ship? In the movie it clearly states it could only be operated by a vulcan. Thus, if Geordi built it, it also could be flown by a human.

      Let’s take the film at face value.

      *Nero still has to wait for Spock who may or may not show up. In the film, he thought Spock arrived AHEAD of him. I recall someone saying “well it makes sense because there was a deleted scene where Nero and his crew were in a prison camp”

      So they could still miss Spock emerging out of the hole; some goofus also gave them thier futuristic ship back with the drill intact.

      I been wondering…what if someone went back into that hole? Would they get back to the other side?

    4. Alfie, I would think that they were crazy.

      Unless of course, they showed up in a big hunk of a ship from the future, tested postive for Remus (Nero’s Romulus side) and had special knowledge of next week’s headlines.

  58. Unfortunately w.o reading the comic prequel, or them showing us all the information in those comics during the film – then you are right. Weak villain. The politics really plays in a lot in the comics. Understanding Nero’s motivation really requires people to have a good handle on Spock’s relationship with the Romulans (as established in Next Generation).

    Also I think Nero is saving Romulus, by just destroying the Federation. I’ve got no problem with him waiting for 25 years to screw Spock. I just wished they had done like an animated prequel or something.

  59. i reckon you should over think it some more :p

    but i agree with you about point 2.
    its a massive hole.

    its still a million times better than all three prequels and still the best film of the year

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