Hey there guys. Here is the LIVE Uncut which originally aired Friday May 4th 2007. The WHOLE ENTIRE show was dedicated to Spider-Man 3 which Doug and I had just seen a couple of hours previous to the start of the show. That’s it… we just talk about Spier-Man 3… and the talk isn’t friendly. :P
You can listen to the show here:
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Well…whatever that was good with spiderman 3…THE ENDING SUCKS!
I expected more than just peter and MJ dancing…I thought that the ending for spiderman 2 was better…web slinging off instead of just a dance…
I have to say that when I left the theaters I was like.. hmmm.. not what I expected. I expected to be pumped up or something. I was frequestly bored during the movie. I know a lot of people keep raving about the sandman and say venom should have been left out, but I think it would have worked better the other way around. They could have done the same story, Parker fighting over his inner demons and guilt with hs relationship with Harry and then been taken over by venom because of this, and then the conclusion with Harry and Venom all without Sandman and I think it would have been a stronger movie. You would have had more time with Venom. I do think they should have spent more time on the parasite taking over Eddie Brock, but the retracting didn’t bother me because that was how it went with the venom parasite, at first you control it then it controls you. More angst, less talk and definitely less singing… Good lord that was painful. Sandman(who I did think looked awesome) just was left hanging… What happened in that ending? I don’t even understand. A lot of it was too lighthearted and goody goody and not enough of the Darkness that we all love Sam Raimi for, sigh. Was I disappointed? Yes, but I did like it. It got about a 5 from me. Worth going to see the graphics, but catch a matinee.
I forgot to mention my 7 year old son was asking to leave about the dancing scene time. Whats that, a little over half to 3/4 way through it. When your 7 year old says lets go it’s got to be LAME. I managed to talk him into staying for a bit longer to see the Venom Sandmand faceoff.
This was one lame movie. What was with all the crying? Everyone in this movie cried. Tears were flowing from all the caracters. Even in the flashbacks with Uncle Ben, he had tears flowing as he was shot down. Peter and Mary Janes eyes were literally red throughout the entire movie. I felt as though this movie was shot by some soap like Days of Our Lives or All My Children. This could have been a 35 minute movie. Venom was developed at the last minute in the movie. Peter dancing was embarrassing to watch. Really. I just wanted to leave at that point. But I endured on to the almost bitter end. Venom got wacked and we were out of there. Who cares how it ended, I wasted enough of my time on this lamer. Wait till it comes out on dvd, then wait till it hits the 99 cent rack at the movie rental. Then wait for half price Tuesdays. You’ll thank me for it.
oh my goodness, i am utterly disappointed in this film. i’m glad my 6 yr old son liked it. there were other kids his age and they were totally getting bored/grossed out by all the friggin’ romance going on and not to blame them so was i.
the whole dark peter thing??? that was stupid, they could have made him cooler without making him look like a tool. i mean come on, the way he was strutting down the street checking out the chicks reminded me of john travolta in saturday night fever… geez.
i wanted to stick around after the credits to see if there was anything, my kid wanted to go, i don’t blame him, it was after our lunch. was there anything after the credits???
Even worse, why weren’t the police called at the end of Spidey 1? Your father has just been murdered, you saw Spiderman standing over the body, and you don’t call the COPS? NO INVESTIGATION is ever done into the death of Harry’s dad? Must not have ever been an autopsy done to determine cause of death, huh? It wouldn’t take a genius to figure out that Harry’s dad was the Green Goblin. Okay, the cops were on the scene at the bridge incident, so they saw Goblin fly away with Spidey, right? The cops knew a general idea of where Spidey had been taken, right? They couldn’t go into that building and find the bloody-ass glider, compare it with the puncture wounds on Harry’s dad, and say “AHA!”? What the hell ever happened to the original glider and suit? Spidey takes Harry’s dad home nekkid or something, so where’s that evidence? Plus, that Goblin charcter hasn’t shown up around town since Big Poppa croaked. Coincidence? HMMMM……
Plus, Harry, THINK, why the HELL would Spiderman kill your father? What motive does he have? Don’t you think he would have seen a news report on TV about Spidey and Gobby at the bridge and think, “Well, my dad runs that company that made the Goblin thing…and he is disgruntled….and he was out of the house the same time as that fight….OH…..”
Kristina,
That’s actually a really good point. Never thought of that.
I just thought of this, so forgive me if I ramble here a bit: In Spidey 2, when Harry finds all of the Goblin gear, does he know that the Green Goblin was his father? If so, then shouldn’t he realize, “Hey, that green fucker running around who killed all those people and nearly caused MJ’s death at that parade/festival thing a while back, and the guy who blew up Aunt May’s place, that psycho was my DAD! So, if said psycho was my dad, and he put people’s lives at risk, I guess Spidey wasn’t at fault for harming him. Maybe he did the whole city a favor!” Does that not make sense? Does he know Gobby was Daddy? Anybody?
Tombo: The butler (played John Paxton) was in all three films. While what he says does propel the story forward, it is the idea that he’s only telling Harry at that point in time, when most likely the best time would have either been at the end of 2 (when Harry found the lair) or at the beginning of this film.
@Gio and/or Doug (or even Rodney)
On reflection, I’m also going to throw out this theory on how bad Venom was handled. Is it possible the character wasn’t up to full potential because while Raimi at one point was not a “fan” of the character- he may very well have interpeted the character due to a lack of unfamiliarity? Especially if the character is somewhat pushed on him?
Just a thought.
On the one hand I think please don’t make another movie its already ruined lets not make it worse… but on the other hand i think maybe they should to try and redeem the franchise because it would be a pitiful ending… i am too confused!
I guess its not really worth thinking about seeing as its going to happen one way or the other now! I am just not going to get hyped like i did with this one… big mistake!
Apparently the studio has just confirmed that they will make “at least” 3 more spiderman films… What shocking news!
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/6630521.stm
“Sony Pictures chief executive Michael Lynton told the BBC: “Everybody has every intention of making a fourth, a fifth and a sixth and on and on.” ”
ug..
The film has already made 375 million dollors world-wide. My goodness.
The butler himself didn’t bother me, but I was also extremely curious about the wound he cleaned and why he didn’t question it being from the glider. Although I can see where people are coming from, saying he was a weak plot device.
Also, I agree about finding Harry instead of Sandman.
Also, I DID notice they never once uttered the word “venom”, but never thought anything of it till now. Venom was just a whiny bad guy who lost his girlfriend because he cheated to get his job and lost it because of that. PATHETIC.
Dark peter looked like a knob thats what he looked like… as did Topher Grace throughout the whole movie.
3 cheers to Sam Raimi for completely fucking up what I previously considered to be my greatest series of movies!
I mean seriously can you imagine the script that piece of trash must have come from? How didn’t that get laughed at and tossed away?
Hello Mr butler man who we have never seen before have you by any chance come along to clear up in 10 seconds what has built up over the 2 previous movies… Gee thanks for that insult!
Hi my names Venom i’ll be your side-badguy for the last 10 minutes of the movie… i’m not going to do a lot aside from hold spiey down so sandman can have all the fun… nope thats right i am not even gonna have a real fight with spidey. To tell you the truth i am not going to even call myself venom once so without the marketing or previous knowledge you would have no idea who i was.
Don’t know why i decided to write like that i just felt the need… grrr!
Yup he did, complete with the hair flip.
And the IMDB is down to 7.1 now. It was 7.3 yesterday. It’ll be very interesting to see how much the box office drops off next week.
Oh yeah, and it made almost 150 million dollars this weekend. Insane.
Am I the only one who thought “dark” Peter looked like the goth kid from South Park?
The more I think about the butler, the less it makes sense. He cleaned the wound, and he could tell by the wound that it was from the glider? Uh, HOW? What are you, a CSI guy in disguise? THE FUCK? That’s not only lazy, but nonsensical as well.
” Also, the fact that SOMEHOW he found Sandman magically in an alley, somehow knew what he looked in in true form, and just fell in with the suit after about 3 seconds. Someone clue me in if I’m wrong here.”
It’s funny, because while that thought occured to me too, if I said it, someone would think I’m over analyzing the picture….but, in any case, you aren’t wrong.
For now, on the surface, it is a plot hole. If the Symbiont has Peter’s abilities and memories* then why look for Sandman if Sandman is thought to be dead? Venom should be looking for..HARRY. Brock explains “Parker is a jerk, he betrayed you, scarred your face and didn’t try to save your father. Put on this Goblin mask here…”
The only possible explanation is that, in the black suit, the symbiont sampled a bit of Harry…and a bit of Sandman. If it is the latter, then
>>
Venom blowing up will turn into black sand. Within time, will reform. Since bits of Brock is blown up/disintigated with him** Brock can return from the dead as well. Or In 4, serial killer Cletus Cassidy puts a kidnapped victim there and is taken over by a mutanted red sym…oh, never mind. Wouldn’t want to give folks funny ideas. Note that a bit of the symbiont still exists in Connor’s lab.
*why just go after Mary Jane? Why not take the girlfriend -Gwen- that you mistreated and dumped you, too? Hell, why not have MARY JANE SAVE GWEN STACY? That would be a twist on the MJ in danger plot device, yes? Or Spidey tries to save Gwen and her neck accidentally…oh, forget it.
**speaking of disintergrations, if one pumpkin bomb can vaporize three guys in the first movie…
***I never got the talking mirror of Norman Osborn either, unless before his death Norman put the green liquid enchancers in the bourbon.
BTW, this dude I met tonight hates my impressions and just keeps saying I have to read the comic books for anything to make sense in this movie and that all of my complaints are invalid because I haven’t read the comic book. And that Gwen Stacy was needed because Kirsten Dunst is refusing to come back.
Thoughts?
Things I liked about the film:
It was funny –
Emo-Peter was funny. The dancing was cute. The fight scenes were pretty cool (in my book). The end team-up was pretty sweet. Topher Grace wasn’t bad at all, I actually liked him more in this role than any other role I’ve seen him in (movie-wise). I had no problem with Kirsten Dunst or her acting role again…she did a fine job of playing a total whiny bitch. The Sandman’s graphics were really good. The graphics in general was good. The one-liners got a ton of laughs in the theater I was in. The restaurant scene with the waiters and Bruce Campbell – hilarious.
The bad –
-The Venom story felt forced, stupid and out of place. It should have been kept out. The dancing sequences were not necessary and only added pointless material to the film. The emo was even stupider and the fact that he was all happy and stuff during it.
-Spiderman not even QUESTIONING the black suit.
-Gwen Stacy – I had no problem with her storyline, but it seemed completely wasted and not required.
– The bad guys’ stories seemed weak to me. Brock wanting to kill Spiderman for taking his job – lame. The fact that Sandman is getting shot at by the police, then all of the sudden he’s robbing a bank?
– The police chief not seeming to know his daughter’s schedule or whatever…the fact that he hadn’t met the BF yet…and the fact that Brock was all “THIS JOB IS THE MOST IMPORTANT THING TO ME IN THE WORLD! IF I DON’T GET THIS JOB SHE’LL FINALLY DUMP MY SORRY ASS! NOOOOOOOO”. – lame. Also, the fact that SOMEHOW he found Sandman magically in an alley, somehow knew what he looked in in true form, and just fell in with the suit after about 3 seconds. Someone clue me in if I’m wrong here.
– The Venom suit – in a lot of shots, it looked like unfinished CGI, as if they ran out of time creating it on the computers.
– The end of Sandman, as another reader mentioned. He just flies off…WTF?!?!
– M.J. Turned into a complete bitch, didn’t like her. Also, the fact she was like, “OK Harry my best friend, I don’t know why you’re hurting me, but I’ll break up with Peter! Whatever you say!” And the fact that she didn’t even stop to think, “HEY. My bf is SPIDERMAN!!! HE DOESN’T DIE THAT EASILY!! HE CAN TAKE ON HARRY” Also, in my opinion, she turned into a whore.
– In the bell tower, Eddie SOMEHOW figures out it’s Peter Parker up there. Lame.
– Somehow a pumpkin bomb going off in Harry’s face doesn’t kill him and leaves his face scarred/mangled, but right after his huge fight with Spiderman all of his bumps/bruises/skull is all healed up. Remember MJ going “there’s not even a scratch!”
– Jonah not losing his temper more – seemed unbelievable, especially since he has that temperment and I would imagine have an incredibly tough time controlling it.
– I didn’t feel a whole lot of emotional connection to the characters in this film. I TOTALLY did in the 2nd film. This one…not even close to what I did previously.
– The fact that when Harry got impaled by Brock, the action just stopped dead…then started up again….I don’t know about you, but if I was Venom, I wouldn’t stop all of the sudden and disappear or whatever, then come back 15 or 20 seconds later or however long it was.
– Venom was lame. Praying to God to kill Peter Parker – lame.
– I will probably be going to see this movie again next week with a friend who didn’t get an opportunity to see it THIS weekend…I may come up with more stuff next time.
– Also, the fact that when Spiderman and Sandman fight in the truck, does Sandman NOT realize or care that NO ONE IS DRIVING THE TRUCK?!?! It somehow STAYS on the road, and he goes about his business of robbing it? And then 30 seconds later (after running through God-knows how many lights/intersections/civilians/children/etc.) it FINALLY hits something? ARE THEY KIDDING ME?!?!
– Also, someone explain to me the talking dead dad thing. I’ve NEVER understood it. It’s always seemed incredibly lame. The fact he’s standing there, then sees his dad in the mirror talking and it all comes back to him out of the blue — someone clue me in. I’m confused.
I’ll think of more later, I’m sure.
“Harry’s butler=deus ex machina”
Didn’t I warn you guys? When you see the butler come out in the final act, get the hell out of the theater…cause the film just goes ALL to hell at that point.
The more I think about this film, the more depressed I get about the missed opportunities.
wut happened to jessie boner, he is better then doug, doug is just way to nerdy for me to like him
Even crazier? Lucky You didn’t even make a million dollars Friday. DAMN you got OWNED.
59 million opening day….biggest opening day of all time….
59 fucking million in one fucking day.
insane.
Harry’s butler=deus ex machina
My words to Avi Arad:
If you chase two rabbits instead of on, both will run away from you.
And one more thing…when the symbiote first attaches to Peter, he’s in bed with his red suit on. The symbiote covers the suit, turning it black. Later on, when Peter’s in his closet, the red suit is in the closet, while the black suit is in a chest. HUH? Does he have more than one red suit or something? Wasn’t clearly explained.
I finally saw it today. It SUCKED. Why the fuck did Venom keep taking his face back to Topher face? LAME LAME STUPID WASTE OF MY FUCKING MONEY. And the score on IMDB is starting to drop. It was 7.9 yesterday, and is now 7.3. VERY disappointing movie, and undeserving of the money it’s making.
70% of the movie was crap. The pacing was so slow. I was stunned by the bar scene. Why oh why was that in this movie? I kept asking myself, “Am I going to see Spiderman at some point in this movie?”
Too many un-developed characters. Didn’t Hollywood learn anything at all from Batman 4. It had like 8 primary characters and non of them were given time to develop. Batman and Spiderman are not typical ensemble cast movies. Everything has to flow from the primary hero.
Kirsten Dunst looked like Lestat had sucked her dry. She was almost transparent she was so white.
Toby is starting to look his age. The CGI for some of the venom v. spiderman shots looked almost as bad as the CGI in the last Matrix movie. It just looked fake.
A lot of the action felt very claustrophobic. Can I get a wide shot please?!!!
Badass Peter Parker was a doofus. He was like an emo clown. I wanted dark and brooding.
My expectations were so high after Spiderman 2. This movie is not worth owning as it would sully the other 2 films with its putrid script, terrible acting, and lack of comic book action.
Questions:
Why was Gwen Stacy in this movie? (Although I did like the way they shot the crane scene…)
Why did Doc Conners call Peter and tell him basically the same thing that he told him earlier?
Why did Harry’s butler wait until now to tell him the truth? Seriously bad/convenient timing.
Spiderman 2 imho will be known as the finale for this cast as it ends on a high note wheras this movie had 3 endings, none of which felt meaningful or captured my inner comic geek.
[end rant]
The scene where Toby looks “emo” was really cheesy. He didn’t come off as ‘bad’ at all, he just looked like a loser.
I also agree with you guys that MJ was being a bitch. She just didn’t stop complaining.
Also, Venom was good, for the whole 10 minutes he was in it but Topher Grace wasn’t a good choice for him. The whole time I could only imagine Eric (from That 70’s Show) in a black suit. (Kind of funny)
I also have to comment on Sandman, I thought he was awesome.
The film was good, but could of been (and should have been) so much better. The main problem was that the plotline seemed to choppy.
7/10
I have yet to see this movie, but I’m very upset about what I’m hearing so far. Seriously, I had high hopes for this one. I was slightly discouraged when I found out their would be so many villians. I still had hope. But all that is gone. But you know what guys? At least we know The Dark Knight is going to be awesome. Nohlan knows his fans, and wont kill off The Joker.
John, I will give this movie and 8. It’s not perfect and most of my problems stem from the fact that it was, at times, too funny. I never felt that it dragged, I was always engaged and I really liked “DucheBag Peter”. I was not evil, it was just an asshole. I mean, I didn’t want to see him eating small children and hot dog vendors. And at the end, I felt very satisfied. I knew it wasn’t perfect, but I enjoyed myself a hell of alot. And in the end, that’s what matters.
I went to see it this afternoon with the wife after listening to this show last night. I thought to myself “Well, at least my expectations are lower, now I’ll probably enjoy it” after listening to you guys.
Nope. The movie was worse that you said it was. Just a gag reflex poking disaster. I love Sam Raimi and everything he’s done with Spider-Man up until now. But bottom line here, he totally blew it. Save your money folks, this things sucked.
Oh ya, that too, this movie is long. They could of easly taken out some of the usless crap and given Sandman or Venom more screen time or just cut it down period. This movie did really feel like Raimi didn’t care much about half of it. But ohwell, the effects and action scenes were still some of the best ever.
Well, after a day and a half of thinking about the film: I dont think it’s as terrible as most of you are saying. I dont mind Kirsten Dunst since I never got into the comics (they didnt sell in Slovenia, so they stopped with issue 6 or 7, and it’s expensive for me to import) but I did watch the cartoon, but it’s all fuzzy. :)
I dont have a clear picture for Eddie Brock and Venom or Sandman or any other character. What I know, I mostly know from the first two movies, which were great and again, I dont see anything wrong with Mary Jane in the first two movies. BUT, she was a bit annoying at the beginning with her: Got a bad review, the world is collapsing and going to see Harry. Come on, so what if your boyfriend is having the best time of his life, if there’s something wrong you tell him. Jesus. When I’m in a good mood and my girlfriend isnt, she tells me what’s wrong and I try to help her, but this was another lame stupid plot that dragged to long. So, the relationship part sucked. Gwen was not needed. It would be better if they skipped the “i got fired from Broadway” and have Peter getting a crush on Gwen. At least she would have something to do.
Loved the emo part of Spider-man. It was funny. Also loved Bruce’s cameo and Jameson. Both great. Ted Raimi was being Ted Raimi. But the scene worked because of Jameson and I was laughing hard.
Villains. Sandman was great. His ‘birth’ was awesome. Learning to control his new ability. Great.
Venom. Well, I understand why Brock was mad at Parker, but still, wanting to kill him. Actually I dont remember, if he saw him and Gwen together at the jazz club. Did he? It would make a bit more sense. Got him fired and stole his girlfriend. Sure, I’d probably wish to beat the guy, but kill him. Not that convincing.
I didnt mind multiple villains, until they killed Venom. They should have let him live. If he lived and they made Spiderman 4 with Venom as the main villain it would be great.
And yes, STOP showing your face to your enemies!!!!
The butler: it was kind of funny.
Damn, by the sound of it, I must have really disliked the movie. Actually no. I still walked out of the movie entertained. The movie had great laughs, great action, and if they didnt kill Venom, all else would be forgiven.
If there is a Spider-man 4:
1. They will probably bring Venom back, because I read somewhere that some unnamed actor said, that apparently he wasnt dead. Harry had a funeral, which leaves Venom.
2.NO MORE relationship troubles, please!!!!!
3.DONT LET THE VILLAIN KIDNAP MJ AGAIN!!!
Bottom line: I enjoyed the movie, never during it I wished to end quickly or thought how bad was that. Well, there was that scene with the flag that I just went: NOT AGAIN!!!!!!
Well, I saw Spider-Man 3 lastnight. And I gotta say I really injoyed it. No it wasn’t perfect, but it was a very fun movie for me.
!!SOME SPOILERS!!
The only things I didn’t like, was both Venom and Sandman should of been in it more, or just one should of been in this film and save the other for part 4. The effects were outstanding, the creation of Sandman was outstanding, but the fact Venom only had the mask on a couple times was annoying, but when it was on, holy crap that was bad ass cuz it was done so well, even his voice sounded cool. But how he became Venom was lame. They didn’t even show him leanring any of his powers or again, like when it was on Spidey, questioning the thing.
Sandman was awesome and the fact he would control sand and make himself bigger suprised me. And how he would use the wind to carry him in sand form to, in a scence “fly” was really cool. That was great. I just wish he had more lines and more fleshed out. And as a miner complaint, I thought when he was doing to monster roar in giant form was kind dumb. Wouldn’t of been so bad if it wasn’t the same monster roar I’ve heard in other films, stull would of felt stupid though.
Some of the things that happened with MJ and Peter were stupid and even pointless, but for the most part I injoyed it, but yet, Dunst was annoying and drug the film down some. Did she have to sing twice in the movie? SO much in the film did feel like everything just fell into place TOO conveniently. But I can understand for how much content they were trying to put into one film. Most of the dark tones of the film I thought were great and fun to watch.
There was ALLOT of stuff in this film, maybe too much, but it wasn’t as bad as I thought it be in that aspect. I was all in all a fun comic book movie and the battle at the end was jaw dropping for me. It was done in true comic book fassion all the way and I felt it was a really good closing battle for this Trilogy. They’re were some cheesy and annoying lines in the film, but most came from none of the lead characters. Theres a little kid that says “wicked cool!” in the film and I just wanted to clap myself in the face on that one. The hate between Harry and Peter was great and well done, just rushed.
Venom dying however was my biggest upset. I went into this film knowing he wasn’t going to be in it much, but I still really wanted to see the film for the character. But I wanted Venom to live so they could have him back in part 4 or 5 with a bigger role in the story. Part of me knew he was going to die anyway, cuz Raimi has said it before that he didn’t like Venom. But I still held on to some hope he would live.
BUT NO, my dream was crushed and all Venom was was a side character to be swept under the carpet and forgotten. One of the best comic book villians EVER. But, my optimistic friend, whos and avid Venom fan like myself thinks that Venom didn’t die, because Venom can camouflage. But I’m pretty sure thats just wishful thinking on his part. And yes, Venom’s death was weak, Not how Spidey got Eddie out of the suit, I really liked how they took Venom’s weakness from the comics and how Spidey used that, I thought that part was cool. But his actual death was just lame, period.
Then they’re was Harry’s death. It was cool what happend where Venom impaled him, but when Harry was laying down below and dying while Spider-Man was up top talking to Sandman, shouldn’t Spidey of rushed him to the hospital to try and save him if they really were best friends and he did care if he lived or die? Or was Harry’s wounds so bad that they knew he’d die either way? It’s funny too, cuz earlyer in the movie when Peter thought Harry was dyed the first time he was all trying his best to save his life, and then at the end, not so much.
All in all the film did feel bloated to the point were some things didn’t make scenes and did kind of make the story feel stupid. But bad points aside I still really injoyed it as a comic book movie and closing for a trilogy. But yes, it could of and should of been a hell of allot better. For the story I injoyed part 2 allot more, but for the final battle, the effects, and darker side of this one, I injoyed it allot. And while I do have to say part 2 was better for sure, part 3 was still a really cool movie. If I had to rate it, I’d give it about a 7.
To Int’l friends: please skim my comments as I may mention a few spoilers. I’ll give at least ten things I liked/loved:
1) The Peter Parker/Harry Osborn conflict. Not to mention the scenes in the third act, when Harry has an offer to forgive, to be redeemed, and to have small revenge (guess who’s coming to HIM for help-the best revenge of all) …although, some parts of this were also the weak points. But without question the best part of the film overall.
I didn’t mind Harry helping out in the end, but he should only be helping out- not saving the day.
2)Kirsten Dunst/Mary Jane. I thought the “jealousy” part of the film had some strength to it. She’s jealous over Peter’s Spidey fame as she struggles as an actress; she’s jealous over Gwen Stacey, who is Peter’s lab partner- and just happens to be…”a model”..? A bonus was the idea that despite a nice singing voice, the “critics hated” MJ’s performance. It got a nice laugh from the audience, as in some eyes, life may well imitate art.
3)Peter’s small flirtation with Betty Brandt. In the comics, they did have a fling for awhile. Nice touch.
4)Landlord Diktovich/ humanizing supporting bit characters from the previous film.
5) Sandman/special FX with Sandman/Thomas Hayden Church.
6) The spider-like movement of the symbiont.
7) Curt Connor’s office. In the background: foreshadowing of things that could happen in the future.
8) Bruce Campbell.
9) JJ’s “buzzer”.
10)The Venom transformation on Brock/Brock’s wicked smiles as Venom, upraised brow.
Now, what did I despise? Let me say it this way: an above commenter said during the Uncut that Gio and Doug used too much colorful language. Ha! Not nearly enough. You guys were in a PG rating mode as far as I’m concerned.
What did I hate?
1) Venom. While “the villain” is the symbiont itself, the lethal protector was hardly seen at all. When he was…he was the worst CGI I seen in years. He was a cartoon. Not to mention a weak villain, who “may” have had potential, but that potential was missed. By the way, if it makes anyone feel better, that small bit of symbiont is still in Connor’s lab. Now in 4, thanks to a suggestion from Avi Arad, Cletus Cassidy breaks in and..oh, sorry. I don’t want give Avi Arad any funny ideas. It would have been better to introduce the black suit and Eddie, and wrap up the Harry storyline, making way for Eddie.
As it is, “Venom” as we know him, isn’t “the” fan favorite. If he is, why discard the character where “Venom” is not in the film that much? It could have been The Vulture, Rhino, Tartantula, Rhino, Slyde, Scorpion…anyone. Anyone! “Venom” was wasted, period. I feel that this may have been Sam’s screw you message to Avi Arad.
2) Sandman. Because of ‘Venom’, this character gets shorter screen time. Spidey thinks he killed him; Sandman doesn’t reappear until much later as opposed to sooner; the sick kid and the estranged wife (why cast Theresa Russell if she really isn’t there?)seem forgotten. There’s a lot more complexity to the character, and it’s all but shoved away. And flying away like a sand cloud? What’s Sandman going to do? Turn himself in or rob more armored cars? These are story problems that character problems.
3)New Goblin. Yes, I liked the conflict. I also hated the obvious. We see Goblin masks- even a gold (?) one? Not used. Pumpkin bombs and razor bats-okay. Self-built enhancement chamber? Bullcrap. Unless his father built it- but why? Harry Goblin choke holds Mary Jane. She makes zero mention of it to Peter.
4) The butler. Talk about forced exposition. It also suggests the butler has seen the goblin glider close up?
5) Tobey Maguire. Not as convincing being a ‘dark’ Spidey.
6) Hoffman’s pitch.
7) The Jazz club scene/Peter’s version of Gene Kelly. Also the whole scenes with him strutting like Travolta from ‘Saturday Night Fever’.
8) Flash Thompson. Should have been more than a silent cameo. What’s wrong with him going up to Peter and saying ‘I been rough on you in school years ago; Harry’s gone, but you got this friend left”. Hey, if the film is about forgiveness, that’s acceptable.
9) Gwen Stacey/Bryce Dallas Howard. More flirty than Mary Jane. Hmmm…more hot than Mary Jane…also a model. “That’s Gwen up there”. Here’s what I thought in the theatre: have evil Spidey accidently snap her neck in a botched rescue, have a villain fight on the roof with Spidey and Cap’n stacey dies with fallen debris. Eddie takes a picture of both. Eddie gets his office. Alright, that’s a bit much…still…what’s the point of having James Cromwell as Capn Stacey if he is hardly in the film?
Instead of Gwen…how about Felicia Hardy? Think it over.
10) Uneven pacing.
11) Two Hours and Twenty minutes. Could have shaved off ten by getting rid of Venom crap, the Hoffman pitch, some of the Jazz club. Ifthe ten minutes are needed, give it to Sandman and/or Sandman’s family.
12) JJ Jameson seems less “energetic” than the previous films.
Without Venom, without five to ten minutes, the production could have saved 40 million at least. Overproduced, overblown, and…yawn…
the negatives outweigh the positives.
I must admit, even though the film felt like it was too short for what it had in it (ie Venom should have been given his own film), I felt it was too long – as Doug always says, ‘Boil it down’. The relationship stuff was just unneccesary. On MSN.com today they have a pretty interesting article on how long movies are these days – is this a sign that the movie blog is ahead of the curve when it comes to talking about films, or have people been pilfering ideas from you guys?
http://movies.uk.msn.com/features/booooring2007_article.aspx
I posted the following on my facebook page… it seems fitting to place here… I wanted to like it! I was expecting to love it… WHAT A LET DOWN! Like i said when I called in… I feel violated by Raimi
______________________________
Thanks to the Movie Blog I had gotten some advanced reviews for this film, but I kind of like it when that happens, It can make a film better if there is a scathing review, or worse if it’s too glowing and I just don’t get what they see (Lost in Translation anyone? – if i wanted Jet Lag I’d fly across the world, not go and see a movie about Jet Lag!)
Spiderman 3 is out 3 days before it is in the states and since it’s legally out here now, I feel no remorse for posting a review. honestly it was a bit disappointing. The beginning was fantastic, It was off to a quick pace full of the peter/Mary Jane are having some problems and Peter is getting prideful with his powers and the public respect of spidy. Within the first 15 minutes we get Harry (hobgoblin?) Osbourne in an intense first match against Peter who is about to propose to MJ. Excellent fight scene, great effects, good pace. We then have a LONG, far too long middle of the film in which Sam Raimi turns up the camp and turns down the logic. It makes no sense. Gwen Stacy is un-necessary in the film, Spidy rescues her at one point and that’s all she’s really needed for. Sure the actress who plays her looks good, but that’s about it. I’m still waiting for her to be relevant to the story.
The MJ and Peter relationship seemed cold and a bit forced, as other advanced reviews have stated. They could have toned it down and shortened it, make it a bit tighter and you’d have something a bit more subtle and action packed. Even the action scenes seemed a bit forced at times, but they were the best parts of the film. they needed to be paced a bit more slowly in my oppinion, it would have upped the intensity and reduced the campiness of the film and perhaps even developed characters more strongly.
Sandman was the strongest in the film, they needed a bit more time on him to flesh out and deepen his character. The first two films were strong mostly because they were very good about establishing an emotional attachment to the villain. They began to do that with Eddie Brock who becomes Venom, but Sandman is the main baddy in this picture and the focus needed to be on him a little more. There were too many villains, and there was too much going on.
The development of Brock was very good, but they ended his arc too quickly. They should have finished the film with Peter in the Church removing the symbiont and eddy praying in the church as the creature descends on him, envelops him and we have the classic raimey style shot of the camera rushing to a super tight shot of Venom’s gaping Maw. Roll credits…
one thing that I did like was the end of the film. A good novelist does not end his story too quickly, like that Raimey tries to tie up the loose ends here in an attempt at a proper denouement, I appreciate this attempt at closing the story well, but the problem is that logic was given up in the middle, so the conclusions were a bit of a non-sequiter.
Overall this was simply an inferior film. I hate saying that about Sam Raimey, I loved the first two Spiderman films,the Evil Dead films were cult classics, but it seems that his passion and vision which was so clear in the first two spidy films is lost here. too many villains, too much camp, too long in the middle but awesome effects, Venom Looked fantastic except when Brock’s face was exposed, and Sandman was awesome, just not developed enough. I wanted more of sandman actually, I found him a compelling and sympathetic villain, it was obvious that Raimi cared about him much more than he did Venom. Venom and Eddie Brock felt forced in, but Sandman felt cut down out of a need to force in Venom. They could have had brock in there, but have been setting up for another film. Sandman on the other hand could have been and should have been much more three dimensional. it began that way, His relationship with his daughter, alienation from his wife, and running from the police, coupled with the back story of Uncle Ben and his honest remorse about it, being driven by need not greed, made him much more sympathetic than Venom at the point where he came in. It felt too scattered, Flint, Brock, Gwen Stacy, Harry, and MJ all had to be given some screen time and what happened was that the whole film suffered as a result
If they had cut out about 30 minutes from the middle and tightened up the end just a bit it would have been a far better film.
unfortunately this goes down the line as the Batman and Robin of the spider man franchise, all of it’s good points don’t really make up for the horrible pacing of it.
5.5/10 for me (5.5 because of the redemption theme running through it)
Barely a go on the No Go and Routh Scale. If you go – prepare for disappointment. I was expecting better from Spiderman 3.
Good or bad the film is gonna demolish POTC2 opening records. To be fair Spider-man 3 opened at a record 4000+ theaters. What can you do. mediocracy is on the rise. It will be interesting to see how long this film can sustain it’s momentum.
I TO YELLED “ITS A FUCKING STORM CLOUD”.
W T F
V E N O M W A S L A M E
EXCEPT FOR THE MASK ………..P.S. I GET A BOOTLEG COPY OF TRANSFORMERS IN A MONTH…..YET I AM SCUM I BOOTLEG MOVIES THRU EMPLOYEES OF THE MOVIE COMPANIES….TRY TO STOP ME I HAVE A UNTRACEABLE I.P. LOLOLOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
there was so much potential for venom which just got rushed. the fact that he referred to himself as I instead of WE, bugged me. harry teaming up with spider-man was cheesey. also it was my first time listening to the audio blog and i thought because it’s spider-man 3 i’d like to hear your views. all good but the swearing i found distracting, which is weird because i’ve never had a problem with swearing before in films or real life. but it just seemed amateurish when there were a dozen f**ks in a minute. don’t mean to piss anyone off just giving my view. also sandman forming for first time was beautiful.
I’ll keep this this short and sweet…
This was my most anticipated movie of the year and could have been one of the greatest movies I had ever seen…
Instead its a mess, thats it… a mess! The concept of the story was good but it turned out so so badly! Editing was horrible and no one story line had enough focus. Venom needed a movie of his own and Grace was the wrong choice for venom hands down.
I am so dissappointed with this film I have been on a real downer since i saw it. I am tempted to go give it another go to see if it changes my mind on a second viewing but i don’t think i have the willpower!
John, I understand you saying all film is subjective an everything, and I respect that you tip your cap to those who did like the movie, but it is totally beyond me how anyone can justify anything at all about this shit movie. It was the first time in my movie going life that I actually thought about stopping at the box office on my way out and demand my money back. Terrible film.
There is a tendency for negativity in the world.
Spiderman 3 was not perfect. But I did love it, despite the faults that were there. I personally like it the most out of the three. I understand why many others do not share that opinion. I saw many of the points in your review. But I still love the movie.
The message of the movie was “forgiveness.”
It had depth underneath the shallow veneer.
It definitely had more crying in it than in any comic book movie ever made before it.
But I loved it.
I do enjoy The Movie Blog, but I find my experience to be vastly different from yours quite often. More so lately.
Hey there Jagmir
You said:
“did you forget that it is also for kids?”
No, I didn’t forget that at all… but being also “for kids” dosn’t mean it’s ok to be horrible.
I loved the first two films… and they were also “for kids”. A bad movie is a bad movies… doesn’t matter if it’s for kids/seniors/terrorists/adults.
I’m glad you liked it. I really am. But for me, Spider-Man 3 was a HUGE let down.
and i forgot :)
gwen stacy… for me personally Bryce was great. But her character had no reason to be there… at all.
Harry’s butler, the same case like the character gwen stacy, no reason to be there. It’s a mere Deus ex machina to explain Harry how his father practically killed himself. Stupid right? I mean it’s just, once you see him explainig harry with all the calm of the world how he cleaned up the wounds caused by the slide and blah blah; basically it makes you think “why the fuck he didn’t quit the job?!!?” cuz if they tell me my boss is a lunatic that throw bombs and dresses up like a goblin and kills people.. shit that would have scary me really freaking bad. But hey it’s spiderman 3 ;) by now we know it sucked.
And one last thing: Raimi’s brother ?!?!? WHAT THE FUCK WAS HE DOING THERE? NOBODY, listen to me, NOBODY in the theather laughed with his lines. Stupid acting and fuck i bet he was responsible for 2 or 3 of those horrible cheesy lines of the film, i bet you that.
I agree for the most part and would give this film a 5 out of 10 but FOR GOD’S SAKE!…Brock IS a photographer originally…he always was. You’re thinking of Cassidy who becomes Carnage. I can’t believe I’m the only one to point that out.
i just saw the film. And let me tell the first 30 minutes or so make you think the film is going to be fuckin great. They introduce sandman and several other stuff. But all of a sudden everything goes to the toilet after a couple of scenes, the second act of the film (or the middle part) is empty and nonsense. You see Peter being stupid and trying to impress, pretending he is possesed by the symbiote. It SUCKS so bad. Then the tango scenes with Gwen Stacy (and MJ lookin at them). At that point I believe I was seeing Batman Forever with Jim Carrey dancing tango with Nicole Kidman (do you remember that silly scene of 1995’s BF?) Everything so neon and full of light :S well spidey 3 has some of those scenes. After the symbiote takes over, the film practically falls into a doom. The pace slows down, there’s practically nothing that develops the story. Sandman gets lost and we see him sometimes and sometimes we don’t (you get to think where was he during all that time???). And Eddie Brock’s motives to revenge Peter, i never understand him it was so uncongruent. How was he even alive and with a job and a girlfriend (so hot by the way) if he had that attiutude of “I get pissed off and wish death to people that hurt me” Come on, he just lost the job and rapidly we see him praying and becoming venom :S it just happened to fast. Uncongruencies everywhere. And wait! You might say it’s cool the development of the film happens so fast, cuz we’ll se the final battle earlier… well the answer is the “your expectations are a bit too high”. The final battle is the worst of the 3 films. Venom appears about… less than 5 or 7 minutes in close ups, he dissapears just like sandman and we don’t know where he goes. And later he’s back. But does he beats spidey’s butt when he’s on screen? NO. I never saw a clean fight between Venom and Spidey just like we saw on Spidey 2 above the metro with Ock or like the final battle with Green Goblin in S1. Shit. Shit. Shit!! They fucked up Eddie’s Brock Venom and wait! they don’t have enough with giving us this crappy battle, they also killed the possibility of future encarnations of brock as venom :)
The script sucked, NO chemistry between Maguire and Dunst (they acting sucked, it was their worst interpretation yet of Peter and MJ) Topher Grace excellent (his bad parts where caused by the script, this caused his cheesy lines :S) Gwen Stacy (Bryce D Howard) excellent as well.
But too many cheesy lines from everyone and too much funny scenes that are ok for Cheaper by the Dozen or whatever low budget summer film you might think of, but this is SPIDERMAN, a film that costed about 500 million including marketing. But all the few positive things like the superbe SFX, Topher Grace, Bryce D Howard and JK Simmons (is not his fault the writers made the character cheesy and “funny” this time; he just did his job, he acted and he did it pretty well as Peter’s boss) are over shadowed by the stupid cutted story, the bad lines(script), Franco’s horrible acting, the bad and weird chemistry between Maguire and Dunst, that weirdy nerdy distasteful appeal of Tobey that become into a horrible encarnation of Peter Parker and the tiny small part of venom in this film. With or without venom the storyline would have stay the same. Just for you to see how important was venom to the story.
I thought the prior films S1 and S2 weren’t going in the right direction in respect to the story, but at the end of both I was left with a feeling that at least they gave us a good story, a congruent story, and that the only missing thing was the need expand spidey’s story universe, to take advantage of his vast and rich stories, villiains and characters.
But now, S3 gets to another level and makes this spiderman series fall into the same category Superman series of the 80’s and the Batman series of the 90’s fell into.
I hope they change director and if they can kill MJ to get rid off Dunst and get another guy to play Spiderman. Let Gwen Stacy take over and find a better actor that deserves to play Parker.
oh yea john i don’t know why i didn’t mention it when i called during the show but when MJ gets slapped there was a huge round of applause in the theater i was in. thought you might be happy to hear that
I don’t know why you put so much emphasis on your dislike for Spidey 3 John, maybe its just part of the show (your bickering).
My son and I just saw it and we were talking about it afterwards….it was a good movie…not great, but it wasn’t supposed to compete with the ‘Godfather’ after all…
did you forget that it is also for kids?????
You know, after a stressful week with finals, this show really helps me out. I love you guys, I really do. I was on pins and needles earlier in the day with that fucking test, but I could relax and laugh listening to this.
Did you ever know that you’re my hero……
I said the same thing when MJ was hit but in my screening it was me and my freind only and we laughed our asses off. But then I thought about it even that disappointed me because that bitch didn’t break her neck or anything
I understand Campea you and Doug didn’t like it…
Good thing your not alone on that.
This has to be the first time a good film actually disappointed me! And I liked RESIDENT EVIL!
It was a fun film, and I am glad to see it already. I’ll still buy the DVD. The problem is the damage has been done; after 1&2, 3 has made me figure that 4 isn’t worth waiting for. The money will be enough for a part 4. For me, it’s over!
Btw, in the audience a guy yelled around the end (in a sarcastic note), “Nooo! Don’t dieee!” Never have I been proud of somebody yelling at the right time.
Bay and Pirates 3 are ON NOTICE!
Oh, and for you bootleggers, good luck! The kids are going to be a pain!
Hey MotherNature,
You said:
“The Queen, Little Children, Last King of Scotland, Children of Men, The Prestige, Blood Diamond and The Good Shepherd were all critically acclaimed and I don’t remember you guys talking about them apart from when they came up in Oscar nominations.”
Seen them all… and we’ve reviewed them all (except for perhaps The Good Shepherd). Use the search box at the side bar there and you’ll see taht we’ve devoted a lot of print to all those movies… even aside from the Oscars.
yeah, I know you would’ve liked it to have been a good movie. I guess it was because of the way you were putting so much emphasis on the negative parts of the reviews. While it’s sitting on 60-odd percent on rotten tomatoes. But fair enough if you didn’t like it. As you always say these things are subjective.
As for the expectation/prior knowledge thing I’d be curious to hear your reaction after going to a good movie you don’t know about.
I think there’s a slight tendency for you guys to go to big popular blockbusters. Many great movies come and go while you’re talking about the next expensive comic book adaptation. Have you many of the movies considered the best of the last year or two? For example, The Queen, Little Children, Last King of Scotland, Children of Men, The Prestige, Blood Diamond and The Good Shepherd were all critically acclaimed and I don’t remember you guys talking about them apart from when they came up in Oscar nominations.
“The Movie Blog” is a bit misleading, maybe “The Comic Book/Computer game Adaptation and Big Expensive Action Movie and Occasional Horror and Comedy Movie Blog” would be more fitting.
Sorry for bitching, I think it’s stupid when someone bitches about something they like and I’m doing it right now.
Anyway, you and Doug should go to the theater a couple times a month and walk into a movie you know nothing about. At least checking Rotten Tomatoes ratings first perhaps. I’d be interested to see your reviews of those experiences.
You guys are right about “Spiderman 3” … exactly right.
http://therecshow.com/2007/05/04/spiderman-3-a-review/
Most telling excerpt: “Kirsten Dunst is as appealing as a cold cumshot on your dead grandmother’s ass.”
I agree with you guys 100%
RAY
Hey there MotherNature.
You said:
“I feel like you guys (John’n’Doug) went into the movie looking for reasons to hate it.”
How on earth do you justify saying that? I was quite biased towards LIKING this movie. It was #3 on my “John’s top 10 most anticipated movies of 2007” list. So how do you figure I was “looking for reasons to hate it”????
You have to just accept that just because you liked it, doesn’t mean that other people who didn’t like it were just “looking for reasons to hate it”.
I didn’t like it because it’s a terrible movie… not because I WANTED to not like it.
I agree with just about everything you guys said on the show. I found myself laughing during scenes that shouldn’t have been funny, and much of the story is cheesy and unoriginal.
When I saw the first two films, I left the theatre thinking, “That was a good movie, I enjoyed it.” Then when I saw the movies for the second or third times (usually on TV) I started to notice a lot of inconsistencies, conveniences, and other such plot holes. For Spiderman 3, however, I noticed those all during the first viewing.
I’m generally let down by the Spiderman series. I don’t like the visuals, I don’t like the storylines, I don’t like the writing, and I don’t like the cast. The movies work for me somewhat, but they don’t have what I would like to see in a Spiderman film. I don’t hate them, but I also don’t like them all that much.
Here’s a prime example of something that gets on my nerves about these films. Look at the scene where Gwen Stacy is hanging from a ledge after the crane crashes through the building. Eddie Brock sees her through his camera lens, to which her father responds, “Gwen? What’s she doing up there?”
…Seriously, that’s the first thing that comes out of the mouth of a father who sees his daughter hanging from the side of a building? Yeah, just ignore the fact that she’s probably about to fall to her death. The only thing that matters is why she’s up there…. Ugh. Then Eddie says something to the effect of, “I’m Eddie Brock… oh, and I’m dating your daughter.” Yeah, the daughter that’s ABOUT TO DIE. Once again, completely ignore the fact that she’s hanging from the side of a building. Just make a cute quip about not being introduced to your girlfriend’s father. That scene was totally robbed of any tension by the lame reactions of those two men.
And that’s just one example. Need I remark on the coincidence that moments after the crane plows through the building, the cops and the photographer are instantly there? One could try to make the argument that they were already on their way because they heard that the crane was malfunctioning, but no one would have been notified of the malfunction unless the crane had actually caused some damage, which it hadn’t until it crashed through Gwen’s photoshoot.
I’m sorry. I could go on and on, and I probably should if I want to fully express my disappointment in this film (along with the other two), but I think I’ll just leave it at that.
it was good and i liked it. The bulk of the plot was enjoyable and i sure hope that isn’t the last we see of Venom. My “spidey sense” is telling me that Spidey 4 has his return with the explanation the creature sprung upwards and out the building before the bomb detoanted. Cmon Harry surived a wall more less exploding on him. Venom can just as easily survive.
Take Gwen Stacy out of the movie and then imagine how good it would have been. Shame.
I liked the movie. I feel like you guys (John’n’Doug) went into the movie looking for reasons to hate it. I feel like part of the culture of movie fans these days is to find out as much as you can before the movie so there are few surprises, then go into the movie with high expectations so all you notice are the things that don’t meet those expectations. Do you know what I mean?
I’m sure when we were teenagers we were just so pumped to be sitting in front of the big screen that all we did was notice good things about the movies. So we rated movies on how many good things there were. Nothing good? Bad movie. Lots of good? Good movie.
Now it feels like dwelling on one bad thing cancels 2 or 3 good things. But whatever, it’s your choice how you enjoy/criticize movies. Though I’m sure I remember you saying a long time ago that you made a decision not to be a critic.
(I’ve written this as a discussion, not an attack. If it’s deleted I’ll start wondering about the freedom of speech on this page)
I got to see Spider-Man 3 today. Now first off I loved Spider-Man 1+2 but did I love Spider-Man 3? Yes! Here are my thoughts:
Good points.
Everything with Harry and Peter was outstanding. These two had great chemesry and had amazing fight scenes.
Sandman was suprisly a great character. The Sandman transformation was mind blowing he had an intreating story thats pulls you into the film.
Bruce Campbell scene was hilarious. This has to be the best Campbell appearance in the Spider-Man series yet! Campbell is God!
Topher Grace was good in the role!
Bad points
Venom……….Holy crap he was a joke! What was the point? We see like 10 mins of Venom and 3/4 of is with Venom’s face exposed. There is no ”WE ARE VENON”. Raimi didn’t do anything to change or enhance Topher’s voice when he was Venom. Oh and Venoms death was lame!
Why would Eddie want to kill Peter anyway? He really didn’t do anything bad to Eddie for him to be blood trusty murderer!
Gwen Stacy, no real point of her.
In the middle of the movie it slows down bringing in issues from last two movies. We saw the last two movies, let the story move forward already.
Peter dancing……………………….I want a darker ego driven Peter!
Harry’s butler. You think the Butler would have told Harry about his own dad being killed by his own glider in the first place.
Spider-man 3 is good not great but good. I hope they don’t make a fourth. The fourth should have been all venom but that can’t happen now because he got blown up. Also do you think the venom in the short amount of time could have had carnage