Denzel Washington’s new movie Deja Vu has opening in 3rd place behind 2 other movies already in theri second weeks. There was a time, not too long ago, when the next Denzel Washington movie got buzz just because Washington was in it. And suddenly, out of nowhere, Washington can’t seem to generate buzz while rubbing a balloon against his hair. Why is that? He certainly didn’t forget how to act… just about every performance you see him him he does a wonderful job. He didn’t get caught in some controversy or joined up with some cult. He hasn’t thrown any telephones at bell hop boys in hotels or went on any racial outbursts while doing stand up routines.
It seems like these days no one talks about Denzel anymore. And really… the only working theory I have as to why that is… and this sounds a bit far fetched I admit… but was that fateful night he won an Oscar for “Training Day” as Best Actor when everyone on the planet knew he didn’t deserve it. At least that particular year he didn’t. As a matter of fact, a lot of people to this day point to the Oscars that year as a farce that was pre-determined to be about race.
I personally do not subscribe to that theory, but, you have to at least acknowledge those people that do. You’d have to be a damn fool not to agree that Sidney Poitier deserved the honorary Oscar that night, so there is no discussion there. Halle Berry? Well, in all honesty I had no problem with her winning Best actress that year. Her performance was amazing. Yes, an argument could be made that any one of Nicole Kidman, Sissy Spacek or Judi Dench deserved it more than Berry that year… but it’s not so clear cut.
However… Denzel winning best actor that year was absurd. Man people, myself included, didn’t even think he should have been nominated… and he most CERTAINLY did NOT deserve to win over either Russell Crowe (Beautiful Mind. I didn’t LOVE the movie, but Crowe’s performance in it was easily the best of the year by a mile), or Sean Penn (I Am Sam).
Suddenly you had an Oscar with 3 winners of black heritage, 2 of whom were debatable, and one of which was a pure joke (Washington’s win). All most people could come up with was that the Academy felt like they owed Denzel one for all his previous brilliant work (I don’t disagree with that… Washington is a MASTER actor).
But after that night… it felt like a lot of people just suddenly stopped caring about Denzel Washington (and to a lesser degree Halle Berry). The shine was gone. No one suddenly hated Denzel… it just felt like there was a bit of a sour after taste in people’s mouths after that (which is a damn shame because it’s not Washington’s fault).
But look down the list of films Washington has done since. None of them have done exceedingly well… but more importantly, none of them had people talking before their release based on Denzel’s involvement. There was a time when just mentioning Denzel’s name got people bubbling over a film… but that’s gone now for the most part.
So I put it to you guys. Why is Denzel Washington not so… I dont know… “in” anymore? Why does his name not stir people like it used to? Was it the Oscar fiasco? Or am I way off and it’s something else? Leave your thoughts.
My opinion is that Denzel deserved to win the Oscar that year. He did an excellent job playing a bad cop and he gave his usual stellar performance. Would I have been angry if Russell Crowe won for A Beautiful Mind? I wouldn’t be in the least. Everybody was good that year. I always have trouble deciding who’s “best” among people who have all done such an excellent job. Usually, anyone in the category can win and I can be happy about it.
This brings me to your question about his fizzling appeal, which I’m on the fence about because his mainstream movies still do very well. I think Denzel is an older actor who has been around for over thirty years now and his star is falling. It’s a natural progression in the life of an actor. It doesn’t diminish his greatness. He’s reached his peak and now he’s leveling off. Eventually, he’ll work less and less or move more behind the scenes. Young people bring in the box office dollars. They’re looking for younger actors to swoon over, unfortunately. It’s not fair, but it’s what happens.
Denzel deserved the Oscar that year. Crowe stole an Oscar from Geoffrey Rush the year before for his heroic, but a tad overly dramatized performance as Maximus in Gladiator. His Beautiful Mind performance was better, but I think the academy didn’t like the idea of giving him the nod, especially when he was busying himself that year with throwing bar patrons on top of table tops in Australia. Penn, was about as deserving as Denzel the year Denzel won his Oscar, but the grit and complete immersion into the character of Alonzo really showed the world what Denzel could do. Until then his range seemed limited to portraying positive models.
If anything, I believe Kidman’s performance in Moulin Rouge to be on par with Barre’s performance in Monster’s Ball, but you know what, who cares? Her acceptance speech, to this day, is the most memorable I’ve ever seen. I was more disappointed that year that The Fellowship of the Ring, such an epic, sweeping movie, didn’t win best picture over Beautiful Mind, but perhaps the academy was giving the award to A Beautiful Mind as a means of apology to Crowe, whose performance was truly sublime, but perhaps, just not as iconic as Denzel’s.
I’ll tell you why. Because Kevin Smith is not an Oscar winner who’s boxoffice is declining.
Come on Campea! Your minions are trying to change the subject so you can avoid my question!
What about Kevin Smith? Why does nobody talk about him?
John is probably NOT going to answer my question on having a bias.
A while ago in his 2nd to last mail bag audio edition, I asked for the exact quote from the Regal rep stating that the release of Death of a President was “not a business decision.”
John has not provided the quote. If John appeased my request, that debate would have been over and I would walk away in defeat. But he didn’t do so. And he probably won’t answer my question on being partial to Russell Crowe.
Again, why does John Campea ignore Russell Crowe’s recent box office woes, but shines a light on Denzel Washington’s “apparent” 20 million dollar bomb?
My bet is John Campea is not going to answer. He’ll probably say, “I don’t have time.”
Which is true, a lot of us don’t have time. In fact, I had a long debate as to whether or not to pursue this one. I have to choose my battles after all. This time, I felt Mr. Campea’s argument was misguided and in all honesty, UNFAIR.
So with all due respect John, toss me a bone and answer my question. And if you’re really in the holiday spirit, provide that Regal quote.
Cheers.
DrkWntr195 AKA J.
I was in my speed boat today and I saw John on a deserted island.
DrkWntr>>>>>>>>>John
i dont think the oscar has anything to do with it..i just dont think he’s been picking really powerful roles such as malcolm x and the hurricane pre training day award. his movies are still good and i like to see them but now his movies are pretty much the same characters. I dont know.. i mean denzel deserved an oscar before training day so who cares for which movie, he’s a good actor none the less. i didnt know this was an issue
Good examples JaySmack.
But don’t you think it would be fair if John would mention those names rather than singling out Denzel?
John is so misguided in this post, called him out on this.
I’m still waiting for John’s answer on being so bias?
Denzel’s an odd choice to critique in this case. Denzel almost always comes in first at the box-office, but from where I sit his numbers are totally consistent. He may not ever come into Tom Cruise territory, but Denzel’s not known for being Mr Blockbuster, look at the numbers for his movies and you see that he’s simply a consistent box-office draw known for given quality performances, not a mega star who packs the house. Consider how these other Oscar winners did after their wins and then tell me Denzel’s out of favor with fans:
Clint Eastwood has won two or three Oscars in the last six years and look how badly Flags of Our Fathers did. Tons of buzz, no competition that opening weekend and it still tanked. He would have killed for a 20-million dollar opening. Come to think of it, when’s the last time Clint’s even had a 20-million dollar opening?
Russell Crowe. The name alone is beginning to become synonymous with “underperformed at the box-office.” If he keeps cranking out the flops he’ll be joining Van Damme, Steven Seagal and Wesley Snipes in direct-to-DVD land.
Jamie Foxx. Miami Vice did poorly given the tremendous amount of publicity and did anyone see Stealth?
Renee Zellweger, she had a few hits before her Oscar for Cold Mountain, (Jerry Maguire, Bridget Jones, Chicago) but since CM she hasn’t had a 20-million dollar opening since, even Bridget Jones 2 did badly.
Normally I agree whole-heartedly with John’s analyses but in this case the facts are clear: Had it opened any other weekend DejaVu would have been #1, Denzel’s still at the top of his game. It’s all the other Oscar winners who we should be looking at and asking, “What ever happened to the love?”
John,
You’re more bias than Fox News.
Here you are pointing out the fact that Denzel Washington’s movie lost to some stiff competition and yet you haven’t mentioned ANYTHING about Russell Crowe’s recent box office numbers.
Cinderella Man? Who saw it besides you?
And didn’t Russell Crowe have something called “A Good Year” that came out a couple of weeks ago and completely tanked at the Box Office. According to the-numbers.com, “A Good Year” has earned 7 million since. Not exactly a GOOD take.
Why are you questioning Denzel Washington’s star appeal when his movie grossed 20 million opening weekend (a weekend with stiffer competition than Crowe had a few weeks earlier)
If you’re going to suggest that Denzel lost his touch after he won an Oscar, than you also have to say the same thing about Crowe. The same arguement can be made about Kevin Spacey and a slew of other acadamy award winners who took a dip in the box office. Be fair!
Why are you singling out Denzel? Why the bias?
He’s not fifty yet. He’s 48. But in Hollywood you’re only as old as you look. That being the case Denzel’s still got a few miles left in him.
I think Denzel is just getting old and movie goers want young and fresh. He’s over fifty now.
I dont really understand how John can say that everyone on the planet knew he didnt deserve that oscar. He was who I was wanting to win. You are the only person I’ve ever seen say he didnt deserve that at all. I dont know, but to say everyone thought that. Is a little incorrect.
I don’t think moviegoers even care about if the actor won an Oscar of whether he deserves it. I’ve seen the trailer numerous times and it didn’t capture me. I couldn’t even describe what kind of movie it is and I felt bored seeing the trailer. With the kind of marketing, It’s a surprise that the movie came out at #3. No one even knows what this movie is about by seeing the trailer, it’s damn confusing and it looks like any other action film with a twist.
Hey John.
Didn’t read all the posts, but I do believe Denzel deserved the Oscar for Training Day. His performance was Oscar caliber, and he deserved it (Halle, IMO, didn’t deserve hers, but that’s another story). As to why Denzel’s career is inexplicably going by the wayward side, I feel it’s because he plays too many roles the same way, and people are tired of seeing him play an over-achiever in almost every role he’s in. Also, atleast in my case, seeing the previews for Deja Vu, I had no idea the movie was sci-fi-ish. I thought it was just another version of The Manchurian Candidate.
Denzel is a great, reliable actor, but he’s not a #1 draw anymore. I think he should take a couple small roles in big movies, or even try getting into a big action flick, and change his genre alittle. That might help.
I’m in the Denzel camp too. He came in third against STIFF competition. Happy Feet is a cheery kids HOLIDAY film, and kids fare has been box-office gold since Toy Story, so no surprise that it has legs, (no pun intended) like Cars and the Incredibles before it. And as for Denzel not beating Bond in it’s second week of release? Well, when Bond is good he’s damn-near unbeatable, that’s why he’s been around 40 years. And if you look at Denzel’s past movies you see that 20-million dollar openings are actually par for the course for him- Training Day opened at 21 mil or so. You want to talk about actors whose luster has definitely worn off after an undeserved Oscar win, check out Rachel Weisz’s numbers in The Fountain. 3 million dollar opening weekend? Ouch! And it came in TENTH place? Double ouch! And it did that badly even with Hugh Jackman in it? Triple ouch! I guess fans prefer Hugh only when he’s sporting steel claws and lambchops.
IMHO the flaw DejaVu had was marketing-wise. I mean given the trailers and TV spots, who knew what that movie was? Sci-Fi, Action, Mystery, Supernatural? Nobody knew and the studio never really made it clear. The audience wasn’t properly “positioned” as they say. Denzel didn’t do quite enough personal appearances to push the film (and neither did any of his co-stars come to think of it) and the ad campaign wasn’t nearly as aggressive as it needed to be for a genre piece like this. And I agree with an earlier post that this kind of movie probably should have been released closer to the summer. The Oscar “backlash” theory is fashionable, but given Denzel’s box-office history, and the way that everyone else’s movies did this weekend, it simply doesn’t wash. The movie industry’s been rough on EVERYONE for some time now, and audiences favor “tentpole” films, films like Bond and Happy Feet. DejaVu’s opening wasn’t stellar but it was hardly a sign that Denzel’s losing a step either. That’s my two cents.
*Sorry bout the length of the post everyone, I just wanted to make my analysis clear as possible.
Jay I couldn’t agree more. I’ve always though that the oscar should be awarded to the individuals or films that captivated the audience the most. The danger in this notion is that I could become a MTV Movie Awards type popularity contest. However I do think the Academy should use the public’s opinion and not their own stuck up opinion before deciding on the winners. For the most part they have started to do this in recent years after going two years of THE ENGISH PAIETENT and SHAKESPERE IN LOVE.
AHH John Denzel’s not Tom Cruise. Big box office numbers are not his forte. He has never pursued that type of career. I personally think he should branch out and do other genre of films, and after Ridley Scott’s American Gangster I hope he does. Was his Oscar deserving? I say yes, you disagree. That why we have opinions. The academy didn’t just pull that nomination and win out their ass. Prior to the Oscar’s Denzel was polling pretty high with all the major critics. As for Sean Penn, the portrayal of a mentally challenged individual won’t work with the American public anymore. Americans have Lifetime television which has done a wonderful job with those types of films. I remember when I AM SAM was released, and although it was a tearjerker it was quickly dismissed as a ploy on Sean Penn’s part to get a Oscar. Also it’s no secret alot of people in the industry don’t like Russel Crowe. I think that might have had something to do with it, but you never know. I have said it before only ONE actor in Hollywood can really carry a movie and it’s Tom Cruise. Maybe Brad Pitt too to a extent. Plus if you look at one of today’s most popular actor Leonardo DiCaprio it’s safe to say Denzel can carry a movie better than him. Remember DiCaprio was suppose to absolutely take off after Titanic but has not. He better be thankful for Martin Scorsese. DiCaprio is a great actor but he’s terrible at marketing himself. Anyway count me in the Denzel’s camp.
I dont think the oscar win had anything to do with how Deja Vu preformed at the box-office. The movie didnt do that well because of competing movies and probably the simple fact that the movie’s premise didnt appeal to that many people. Maybe it was “jesus'” fault. Maybe it was the fact that “jesus” was a terrorist in this movie. Maybe it was too convoluted. Maybe it was just not entertaining enough to warrant good word of mouth.
Either way… I dont think it had anything to do with Denzel’s “undeserved” Oscar. Which by the way is just your opinion, and like Kristina said, who the oscar goes to is just a matter of personal preference, not scientific in any way. The idea that one piece of art is “better” or “worse” than another piece of art is solely up to the individual judging those pieces.
The mojority of Oscar voters disagreed with you and gave Denzel the Oscar. Just because you dont agree with them doesnt make the Oscar undeserved. It just means that in your opinion, it should have gone to someone else.
Question: Why does your opinion hold more validity than someone else’s when it comes to something as subjective as art and performance.
Answer: It doesnt.
For that reason, I have never cared much for the Oscars in the same way that I have never cared much for critics. It’s all just somebody else’s opinion.
I think Deja Vu would do better with Matt Damon in it.
Cos why? Cos Denzel has gotten boring.
I didnt read all the comments as there were too many of them…..but as a fan of Denzel, I would say its more about the movies than him winning an undeserved oscar….as you said people know it wasn’t his fault, the Academy has done that a few other times (in fact I felt a bit vindicated when he beat Russell Crowe, because he got an undeserved oscar for gladiator a year ago when tom hanks deserved more for cast away)
I saw man on fire and inside man as they looked interesting….but Deja Vu seemed like any other movie with a far fetched story line….I constantly got confused with the promos of that Taye Diggs show as it was about deja vu too….
IMHO Denzel needs to explore different roles, he’s been doing too many of the same type and people are just not that interested anymore…..
Forrest Gump vs. Shawshank Redemption vs. Pulp Fiction.
Probably the strongest year for american movies in the 90s. Any of them deserved to win it. The fact that one did win, does not mean it should be considered a tragedy that the other two didn’t. That’s how it would be no matter which of them had won.
For what it’s worth, I think Washington’s work in “Training Day” was totally worthy of an Academy Award. He did a fantastic job playing a pretty complex, charismatic, slimebag. I’m sure many would have voted for Crowe as the schizo math guy or Penn playing the retard (which would be business as usual for the oscars imo) but I found it refreshing that someone won for playing the bad guy who wasn’t a weak or sympathetic or miserable character. I thought Denzel really shined in the role myself.
Now, Forest Gump beating Shawshank … there’s your Oscar tragedy.
Agreed with ted. This post doesn’t make any sense, and the points you made are subjective as hell. ‘Everyone on the planet knew he didn’t deserve it?’ The shit?
John, the fact that Happy Feet & Casino Royale were in their second week is COMPLETELY irrelevant. Deja Vu is (or at least was marketed) as a very dark film. How many films opened against them this past weekend, 4-5? And yet, the only one to do anything is a film did NOT have the same mass appeal as the top 2.
There is nothing wrong with his career. This post, to me at least, is a complete waste.
This post should have been about the enduring strength of Denzel to open such a dark film to such good numbers amid so much competition, NOT the other way around.
My goodness! How difficult is it to run freaking SPELL CHECK before updating your bloody website?
I agree that Denzel didnt deserve an oscar for Training Day (even though, he’s had a ton of roles he does..like Inside Man)..but he is a damn fine actor and he is at least enjoyable even in his bad movies (like John Q or debatably Fallen)..but I still enjoy the guys’ screen presence.
But maybe thats because I no longer care about the Oscars. I used to watch it all the time. Now it just bores me. Maybe it’s just how fake the ceremony feels. Maybe it’s gone the way of every other award show.
This whole thing about who DESERVES Oscars is stupid. How can you really judge art for fuck’s sake? Until they create a scientific system to determine who has the better performance, it’ll never be legit. They vote for who they like and who THEY think deserves it. At the end of the day, it’s just a bunch of people’s opinions, some of whom haven’t even seen all of the performances, so they shouldn’t be voting in the first place. Fuck it!
“Make no mistake folks, a good 80% of the Oscars ARE A popularity contest.”
Thank you for making that clear to me Mr. Expert. I will from now on make no mistake when thinking about the oscars.
Enough with the oscar bashing. For every example of somebody winning that you think is popular, I can give you an example of somebody winning who you don’t think is popular.
And everybody who says they don’t care about oscars, don’t deserve to watch them. Because of you people, I have to sit through 5-6 jokes every year about the length of the show. If you don’t want to spend 3-4 hours on the show, then just read who won the next morning. Don’t watch it and then bitch like a pregnant woman afterwards. The oscars fucking rule.
And don’t tell me to make no mistake about what makes people win the oscars. Whatever happened to “I think that…” Pretentious bastards…
Dude, “Inside Man” was Denzel’s best opening ever, and “Deja Vu” is his fourth best opening. He has never been an actor who opens huge like Tom Cruise or Will Smith… I don’t think there is any change…
I think people just cooled on him. Master actor? He’s very likeable, but has he really ever played one character differently than the next? Even Training Day was just a surlier version of every other Denzel.
I’m not saying that there’s anything wrong with this. He plays that one character very well, and is very likeable, but can you honestly say he’s done more than one character (two if you want to stretch Training Day)?
This is how most of the bigger stars are, and they’re all fading. Will Smith, George Clooney, Brad Pitt, etc. In their biggest roles they’re always the same. And people don’t go for it quite as much as they used to.
Halle Berry, meanwhile, has fallen off the planet. She appears in X-Men, that’s about it. A string of awful performances in awful movies has done her in.
Speaking of caruso jmarps…you should all watch this.
its very very funny.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_sarYH0z948
Hey Darren,
You said:
“Denzel’s new film is against Bond and a cartoon with Pengies. Still gets a respectable opening. He’s still a draw.”
You left out one very big piece of info. He went angainst Bond and Happy feet IN THEIR SECOND WEEKS. If they were all opening week films, I’d agree with you… but not here.
You also said:
“I disagree about “Inside Man” just being ‘okay’ as John Campea wrongly dismisses it”
First of all… John Campea is never wrong silly. Secondly, read it again, I NEVER said Inside Man was just “ok”. I said it DID “ok”.
In his career, Denzel has starred or co-starred in two movies that have reached the magical $100 million mark – Remember the Titans, which was a big-time Disney film and Pelican Brief, with Julia Roberts. Inside Man, his last movie before Deja Vu, is the only movie that’s come close to the big one-double-oh since Training Day and the closest non-$100 mil grosser other than Crimson Tide (which had some guy named Hackman in it.)
Denzel has made a career of great performances in good movies that don’t gross particularly well. I don’t think the issue is that he doesn’t get a sniff now. I think the issue is that people drummed up the “travesty” of his not getting an Oscar before Training Day and so he always had a buzz. Now he has an Oscar and until he puts out another performance that’s truly a level above, you won’t hear noise for him again.
“Spike Lee tends to not get mad buzz like other filmmakers” – Travon
There is a good reason for that. The only time he really gets noticed in when he does something like “Do The Right Thing” or “Malcom X”. When he’s left to do other films, he does a great job as well, but there is no “contreversy”. As a result, Spike slips under the radar. In addition, he’s not exactly within “mainstream” Hollywood’s good graces. If it were so, he would have won the kissing up/popularity contest ages ago.
Make no mistake folks, a good 80% of the Oscars ARE A popularity contest.
But I don’t think Washington’s performance is overrated. I think he deserved to win.
In fact, why the hell is this even an issue? People can drive themselves crazy with this stuff.
It is futile and idiotic.
Denzel’s new film is against Bond and a cartoon with Pengies. Still gets a respectable opening. He’s still a draw. Do I think he might take roles that are beneath him? Perhaps, but on some films he also works with directors he has worked with before (such as ‘Deja Vu”s Tony Scott: Lee, Carl Franklin).
I disagree about “Inside Man” just being ‘okay’ as John Campea wrongly dismisses it, a better arguement was that it also had Jodie Foster and Clive Owen in it. One actor may not carry a pic by himself/herself, but get three or four…
I do not know how or why anyone would ever think Denzel is not “in”. Lets do a review how many movies has he been in that open to over 20 million? and his name certainly stirs people his box office numbers show it!….I loved Deja Vu his performance was EXCELLENT in it!….anyone who questions Denzel or his performance needs to check the facts again. Denzel is great and so was his last movie….as far
as him coming in 3rd this weekend Come on it was a holiday weekend and he was going up against what Bond….and still did well If anything this shows how great the movie is and he is! WOOT WOOT Go Denzel!
i still talk about movies when I see Denzel and I was excited when I heard he was doing this and Bruckheimer was producer but then I saw the trailer which makes the movie look boring
For myself, as with others, whether or not he deserved to win is likely independant from his decline in box office mojo. At least it seems implausible that people would stop caring about his films because they believe he won an award he didn’t deserve. I’d really have to see a better argument linking the to things before I would buy this.
no one doubts that he’s a great actor, but i thought he broke out when he did training day, it was a very different denzel in my opinion and thats why he won, Denzel’s roles as of late have been good, but nothing that stands apart like philadelphia, or malcom x…these were roles in which brought out the best in his acting… i mean shit, even crimson tide was awesome acting by him
but the movies he’s done so far are action-based. man on fire, inside man, john q, and theres only so much he can sell you on that he’s doing oscar caliber work, especally with an action film
On a 2nd side note, I do respect the promo work he does for the Boys & Girls Clubs of America. Totally cool. (You probably don’t hear those radio ad spots in Canada…)
I seriously doubt winning the Oscar way back for Training Day made Denzel lose his “luster”. He just hasn’t been in anything real blockbusting lately. Inside Man did well. I hadn’t heard anything about Deja Vu until I logged onto Rotten Tomatoes this weekend. No commercials, no Leno or Conan O’brien interviews, nada, nothing, zipp. I think doing 3rd is still damn respectable.
On a side note, I think he needs to branch out a little and stop playing what I perceive to be basically the same type of personality every time.
Denzel is moving towards supporting/character actor roles. Age is his only issue methinks. He needs to do the occasional comedy.
You make a pretty good point John, Denzel’s recent roles haven’t been all that. I did like him in Man On Fire and Inside Man, but everything else has been iffy at best. Although I don’t think we should discount his performance in Training Day. He did a phenomenal job in that role. For years Denzel has played the good guy, and to see him play this maniacal undercover cop was frightening, at times even disturbing. He DID deserve to be nominated, however I do agree that he did not deserve to win.
Although Crowe did a fantastic job in ABM, he got his statue already. I just thought Denzel did a better job than Crowe. Penn, on the other hand should have snagged it. To say that it was a joke that Denzel was even nominated is ludicrous. Why shouldn’t he have been nominated? I agree with you most of the time John, I just have to disagree with you on this one.
Denzel washington is GREAT in training day !!! This guy is one of the best actor in cinema history, definitely in the top 10 ! He should have four or five academy award winner (Cry freedom, Glory Malcolm X, Hurricane and Training day) and a lot nominations.
Denzel is easily THE best actor of our Time, EASILY !!!
Well, if this movie had not had Denzel Washington it would probably have made 10 million instead of 20 million…
I don’t get how this is a disappointment. How much money should this movie have made? I think it did just fine.
Your theory is far out. Even though I do agree that Russel Crowe may have had the better performance out of the two, he won for an extremely subpar performance in Gladiator, so it all evens out. And you talk about buzz as if it’s something that just happens by itself. You could have created buzz by mentioning the movie again and again, but you didn’t. That’s why there was no buzz.
Someone already touched on it, but I think the reason is racial. Denzel was the best black actor in Hollywood for a long time. Now there are a number of strong black actors and the novelty is wore off.
Average Joe doesn’t remember he won an Oscar for a great performance (in a supporting role) in Training Day or care for that matter. People (myself included) think the Oscar’s are a joke. The idea that winning a shiny statue is the reason he is no longer one of the biggest draws is absurd I think.
John, Denzel has one of the most stable acting careers around. Just because the ‘hype’ doesn’t match what it once did, doesn’t mean his career is on a down-trend.
Although his films may not be huge $300 million blockbusters, they all do consistently respectable numbers. In the 3 decades of his acting career, has there he ever really been in a slump? No!
I can certainly say that I haven’t liked all his films (the horrible John Q, and ridiculus Man On Fire come to mind), but I can’t deny his consistency in the amount of business his films bring, even though those numbers don’t reach the stratosphere.
Buzz these days, is not generated, but manufactured. Denzel is an actor who does his job, and then moves on to the next. I don’t know him personally, but from his career & type of media-b.s. he does (or actually doesn’t do), he strike me as a class act (if not a bit arrogant, but that’s irrelevant to this issue).
For christ’s sakes, he was up against dancing penguins, and a James Bond flick! Deja Vu did not reach third place because of Denzel’s failure to generate ‘buzz’, but it reached third place due to the ‘strength’ of Denzel’s reputation. It would probably have been much lower in the rankings WITHOUT his involvment in the picture.
There is nothing wrong with his career. This post, to me at least, is moot.
Hey John,
I’m experiencing a little Deja vu myself.. Didn’t we just talk about this yesterday? LOL I loved the fact that Denzel won the Oscar, although he didn’t deserve it for Training Day….It was like the Academy realized he was snubbed for Malcolm X and The Hurricane…he was past due. (Although the people that actually won those Oscars deserved them as well.) The reason why I think Denzel has not been getting any buzz lately is because I think he knows he doesn’t have anything to prove anymore. He doesn’t have to bust down the doors with his performances…he’s already proved he’s an amazing and talented actor…He has two Oscars under his belt,and he doesn’t ever have to worry about money.. now is the time to say f*ck it…and do whatever he wants to do.
Plus, in a holiday weekend that just happen to have a animated film, a pg-13 action flick, a couple of holiday “comedies” and the like, how can a R-rated action film by a visual freak of a director (and I mean that with a lot of love) do much better than that? If it was the summer, it might have hauled in more.
Yes, it seems that he has taken a downturn (if you can even call going huge star to kinda huge star a downturn) in the frenzy people get when they talk about his films. But, in general, they seem rather bland. Out of Time, Man on Fire, Inside Man (I like a lot, but Spike Lee tends to not get mad buzz like other filmmakers).
Was his Oscar undeserved? Perhaps. Then again, was Pacino sparkling in Scent of a Woman compared to Washington’s Malcom X? No…Kevin Spacey was good in American Beauty, but Crowe was downright amazing in The Insider. Perhaps they were trying to honor the slights it made in the past. Maybe some think it wasn’t deserved. But I think the mass populace are not thinking “Oh…Well, we can’t love him now because he DIDN’T DESERVE It.” If that is the case, people should be pissy at the Academy. It’s a theory, but not exactly a tenable one.
The MTV movie awards are better than the Oscars. The Oscars are hardly ever in-line with the popular movies. I quit the Oscars in 2005 when Batman Begins got snubbed. They also snub comedies & action flicks way too much.
Let the people vote!!!
Also, his mojo might have gone down a bit based on the scripts he has been selecting. nothing can ruin an actor’s career faster than starring in a series of really bad movies. Just ask David Caruso. (not really fair because he couldn’t act his way out of wet paper bag. Although I did enjoy him in ‘First Blood’)
I think it could be much more simple than this. Maybe it’s just that people are bored with him. He has done a lot of movies and people might just want something different.
John, love your stuff, but I really think you are putting too much stock into this Oscar theory of yours. I think average joe moviegoer couldn’t even tell you he had won an Oscar, let alone two. I couldnr’t even remeber who he went against that year. I didn’t see I am Sam, but I did see ‘Training Day’ and ‘Beautiful Mind.’ I didn’t think it was such a farce. I think you can make a definite argument for Denzel. He was great in that movie. So was Crowe. I think this same thng might have worked against Crowe. We were getting a lot of Crowe movies at that time and people might have been tired of him as well.
I propose that another reason might be the fact that there are more great black actors out there such as Jamie Foxx (Ray, etc.) and Will Smith. We’ve had powerful performances from others such as Terence Howard (did I get that right?). Even Samuel L. Jackson and Morgan Freeman came in late in the game as people were a twitter over Denzel Washington way before Pulp Fiction and Unforgiven. It seems to me that back in the eighties and early nineties, it was only Denzel out there who could pull in awesome performances, but nowadays, the options are much more varied so people are now looking more into the movie itself instead of who is starring in the movie. Just a thought. probably way off. :-)
Oh, and I also think ‘big names’ just don’t sell that well in general. Most of the big hits are franchise movies with a big cast (Spider-Man, Pirates, X-Men etc.) or movie that have something special (like Borat).
Groeten~!
The movies he did just weren’t all that appealing. At least, that’s the way I feel. None of his post Oscar movies have screamed ‘this is a movie I can’t miss!!’ at me. Most of them just look ok (like Man on Fire and Inside Man).
Hey ThS
Ok, but what counter theory do you have as to why no one buzzes about Denzel since that Oscar night? Can’t just say my theory is far fetched (which it might be) without offering an alternative.
Cheers!
As you wrote yourself, your theory is far fetched. Very far fetched I think. Who cares about the Oscars anyway? Not the mainstream audience, that’s for sure.
The movie as a whole just doesn’t seem that great. The trailers didn’t sell me on it at all. The only reason for me to watch it would be Denzel. Ok, and maybe because Tony Scott had done some good stuff (we’ll forget Domino ever happened) in the past.
Hey fearlessweaver
inside Man and Man On Fire both did “ok”… but the issue is that no one really buzzed about Denzel’s precense in them before the release of the films. That’s a HUGE difference from before his Oscar win.
Hey Chris,
No one said Denzel’s performance was a joke. Read it again… I said his WIN was a joke.
Will Smith didn’t win best actor because Denzel won it for Training Day. Can’t have 2 winners. In my opinion SMith deserved it more than Denzel did that year.
Just this year, Inside Man was a big hit, and I think that’s at least in part due to Denzel’s presence. People are glad to support him so long as he’s in interesting projects. Even “Man on Fire” performed well, but it’s not the kind of film for which people are going to praise the acting. “Deja Vu,” “Out of Time” … these are schlock, Jean-Claude Van Damme kinds of movies. We all know that he can do much better work. Few people care (or remember) what happened at the Oscars a few years ago.
His performance a pure joke? No way – he played a character completely different to any he’d done before and did it well. In fact, his Oscar win can be seen as progress – the Academy has a history of throwing awards at actors just because they play disabled people. For once it didn’t go to the easy pick (A Beautiful Mind, I Am Sam) but to an edgy turn in an edgy flick. If the Oscars went to those guys just because they’re black, why didn’t Will Smith get one for Ali?
Training Day is a genuinely good movie — unlike ABM or IAM — and better than anything Denzel’s been in since, with the exception of Man On Fire and Inside Man, both of which did well and get Denzel positive attention…