It’s no secret around here that I believe Pixar is not only the best animated movie studio in the film business today, but also the best movie studio period. They are a perfect 9 for 9 with their films… not only big box office success, not only big critical success, but also huge audience success. This company squats and craps out excellence with everything they do… and now they’ve given us the best film of 2008 (thus far) in Wall-E
But an interesting discussion broke out the other day when one commenter asked why Pixar just makes little kid movies. Why not make movies for adults?
This got me thinking a little bit about the nature of the movies that Pixar has done in the past and continue doing right through to today. My conclusion was this:
PIXAR DOES NOT MAKE LITTLE KID MOVIES. THEY MAKE MOVIES THAT ARE KID FRIENDLY.
Now I understand that on the surface this looks like little more than a mere issue of minor semantics. But if you look more closely you’ll see there is actually a world of difference in both style and substance between the two and the end result are VERY different movies.
There are many 3D animated films that are specifically kid movies. Films like “Kung Fu Panda”, “Madagascar”, clearly “Madagascar 2″, “Robots”, “Shark Tale”, “Shrek” and so on and so forth. Films like these (and many others like them) are writen, produced and completely geared toward entertaining children, and there’s nothing wrong with that philosophy in and of itself if they’re done well. Oh sure, sometimes they’ll throw in the odd pop cultural reference that will fly over kids heads and is aimed at the adults… but the themes and language (both visual and verbal) and style are conceived of and aimed at kids. They are Kids Movies.
But then there’s is Pixar. Yes, Pixar does have some excellent “Kids Movies” on it’s impressive resume like “Bugs Life”, “Toy Story” and to a certain degree “Monsters Inc”. But then a shift became visible that we say elements of in Toy Story 2, and when “Finding Nemo” came out a full fledged new philosophy in Pixar’s creative workflow because evident.
Pixar was no longer just making Kid Movies. They were making films for everyone that were made in such a way to also be very kid friendly. The entertainment of the kid was no longer the guiding principle… but rather making a universal movie for everyone to experience and enjoy while keeping the kids engaged and entertained at the same time. It’s not an easy task, but it’s one that Pixar has mastered and is more than just a semantical variant.
FINDING NEMO
Themes of fatherhood. Life lived in precaution due to tragic loss and the notions of wanting to shelter your child and the desperation of both fear and action when your child is at risk.
THE INCREDIBLES
A slightly past middle aged man reflecting on former glories… but also former potential. Finding himself in a life and life style you never would have pictured. Struggling to understand the balance between the importance of self-actualization, and the responsibility and joy in sacrificing personal goals and ambitions for family, children and marriage.
CARS
The decay of the classic and traditional small town America. Issues of modernization inadvertently replacing the fabrics of small town values and senses of community. The loss of the journey to the expedience of the destination.
RATATOUILLE
Standard themes of pursuing dreams are mixed in with issues of breaking out of expectation. Facing generations old biases and preconceptions, learn hatreds and expectations while trying to overcome them with a wider world view by stopping looking at the problem on a race or national (or in this case species) level and looking at individuals on a personal level instead.
WALL-E
The obvious themes of Environmentalism are also layered with warnings of a society developing an over reliance on technology and a less and less social population that engages more with the digital than with real life human beings
Films such as these can not be equated with films like “Madagascar” and just lumped in as if they were made with the same purpose and the same audience… because they aren’t. One is a kids movies… the others are kid friendly. One type is specifically made for and aimed at kids… the other has a main message that is aimed at adults, but made in such a way that the experience is still a great one for kids.
41 Comments, Comment or Ping
nbakid2000
Excellent article, John.
There are two things I disagree with you about:
1. Pixar does NOT make ALL GOOD FILMS. A Bug’s Life was a p.o.s. in my opinion, and I saw it in 6th grade…and I have never seen it since. I couldn’t stand that movie.
Also, a minor quibble…I could never get into Monsters, Inc. So there’s two movies by them I thought were less than stellar.
And then Cars wasn’t BAD but it was pretty dry. I really have no desire to see it again anytime soon. So…3 films.
2. I would argue that Toy Story is very much an adult film…Sid (spelling?) abusing his toys was actually a pretty dark storyline. The replacing of friends (toys in this case) was something all adults can relate to. The old toys from years past that adults grew up playing with…most of the kids who saw that movie probably had no idea what most of those toys were.
Anyway, like I said…excellent article.
Jul 8th, 2008
John
Hey NBAKid,
That’s cool if that’s your opinion, as long as you also realize that you’re in the massive minority here. Bugs Life has a 91% and Monsters Inc a 95%. Cars is the lowest critic rated film they’ve ever done and it still has a 75%.
So yeah… I stand by my statement, but you’re totally entitled to your opinion.
Jul 8th, 2008
spiderfreak182
Best movie studio depending on how u look at it. Sure they pumped out gold in all their films. to me, a “best movie studio” in my opinion would have to be the studio that can give me a big range of different type of movies, and delivered gold with it.
On the other hand, I love pixar, and i will watch most of their films just because its pixar and no other studio can do that with the exception of the new marvel entertainment (but i cant use that due to the superhero bias).
Because i can’t think of a studio that fits my description, i’d say pixar wins by default till i think it up…
Jul 8th, 2008
nbakid2000
And I’m gonna get jumped all over for this, but I have no hate towards The Incredibles but it’s kinda like Cars…I saw it once and that was really enough for me. I think it’s a good film, absolutely, but for some reason…once or twice was enough. And that’s not to say I won’t ever see it again (I’m sure I will) but probably not for a LONG time. In fact, I thought the first 5 minutes were amazing with the old footage from the 60s…beautiful, jaw dropping stuff.
The thing is, I sound like I have a lot of hate toward Pixar, but I don’t. I think they are an incredible company who makes very good movies, some of which just don’t grab me. But whenever a new Pixar film comes out, I always sit up and take notice and am eager to see it.
Jul 8th, 2008
nbakid2000
John, maybe sometime this week, just because of this article (it has made me think) I will go back and try to watch Monsters, Inc. again. I don’t even think I’ve seen the ENTIRE THING STRAIGHT THROUGH.
Congratulations for tickling my brain and getting the conversation flowing.
Jul 8th, 2008
Marco
I gotta go with NBAKid on A Bug’s Life. It really wasn’t very good. In fact, I forgot it was a Pixar film. I liked Antz better.
Jul 8th, 2008
Marco
I’d love to see Pixar venture into animation specifically for adults though. The world needs someone to make up for “Final Fantasy: The Spirits Within.”
Jul 8th, 2008
Michael
Awesome post John! I’ve been trying to articulate this very thought to a friend of mine for a few days.
Jul 8th, 2008
ant
great post
Jul 8th, 2008
Thos
Good article, well said. I agree 100% I really like Bug’s Life, primarily because the story is almost exactly the same as the Three Amigos (think about it). Pixar is my favorite studio and their films get constantly better with each release.
…and I thought Final Fantasy: Spirits was awesome.
Jul 8th, 2008
Meli
Pixar has without a doubt has set the bar for animated films and I agree they aren’t just for kids. I look forward to each film they produce. So far Cars was their weakest. I couldn’t sit through it for a second time, honestly, I get bored. Bugs Life is cute, but it hasn’t stayed with me like the other films.
Monsters Inc. is still my favorite I love the characters and humor, plus all the colors are incredibly vivid.
Jul 8th, 2008
Zach
I disagree with you completely John. IMO Pixar movies are definitely geared towards children BUT they throw in several “adult” themes in them in order to APPEAL to everyone. Just because they appeal to everyone, it doesnt mean its not specifically geared towards children.
Jul 8th, 2008
Mez
I don’t agree that Shrek is a Kid Movie…i think there’s a lot of jokes that go over their heads.
I love A Bug’s Life
Cars is my least favorite Pixar film but I still thought it was good.
Jul 8th, 2008
46and2
Bravo, John.
Jul 8th, 2008
nautica
how can anyone say a bug’s life is a POS when it’s so beautiful to look at. even by today’s standards. i honestly think it gets a bad rap because it’s the one pixar movie that dreamworks and every other second rate 3d animation aimed at kids copy for their jokes. “oh let’s make a movie about bees and have funny bug characters stuck on the windshield”. hmm i wonder where they got that original idea?
Jul 8th, 2008
Jay
Good stuff John maybe you can add …
A BUG’s LIFE
Is the story of repression, conformity, and the so-called way of life.
Jul 8th, 2008
TheMovieVampire
I’m not a huge Pixar fan (which is mostly a matter of personal taste). But I’ve got to say that I find myself a little annoyed by the cult (I use the term lightly) that they’ve built around themselves.
1. I’m not sure how fair it is to compare them with other studios. When I hear “studio” I think of a company like Universal of Paramount which put out dozens of movies a year. When you distribute a huge number of films like that you’re bound to have a less than perfect record, but that’s made up for in volume. I guarantee you that every one of the major studios have put out more than nine great movies in the last thirteen years. Rather, I’d liken Pixar to a production company (albeit a very large and relatively self sufficient production company). They produce movies, but they’re owned and operated by Disney who also distribute their films.
2. On the bigger issue of whether they make kid movies or not, I also disagree. I find that many Pixar cultists try to pretend that these are adult movies (that kids can like) as a way of justifying the fact that they like a children’s movie. The catch is that there’s nothing wrong with liking a children’s movie, there’s nothing that needs to be justified. But there is something wrong with calling these movies something they’re not.
The simple fact that one can boil these movies down to a set of seemingly sophisticated themes does not make them adult movies, it just proves that they’re more thoughtful and well made than their competators. If driven one could do that kind of boiled down analysis with all kinds of children’s movies, one could describe Shrek as a movie about self acceptance and tolerance, that doesn’t mean it’s an adult movie.
There are also plenty of movies clearly intended for adults which you can’t do that with, like say… Predator. Does the fact that you can’t find complex themes in Predator make it a children’s movie? No. Nor does the presence of them in a Pixar movie audomaticly make it somthing other than a kid’s movie. A sophisticated thematic description like the one’s given in Campea’s article only prove that these movies have thoughtful storytelling, which in the case of Pixar is channeled in a way that is DELIBERATELY DESIGNED to be accesible to children (if still recognized by adults). And deliberately creating somthing to be for children, to me, is what makes something a children’s movie.
Jul 8th, 2008
George
I don’t believe that King fu Panda is geared only with children in mind. It has better action set pieces than any live action film this year. It doesn’t rely on any gross out fart humour. no dated pop culture jokes. And again go and watch the action scenes again. The bad guy escaping from prison is fucking awesome. Name me a better set piece so far this year??
If it was live action it would be a martial arts classic. I loved it
Jul 8th, 2008
Bruce
“They are a perfect 9 for 9″
Says who, you? You say this as if its fact or something. Pixar is now at the point where they can do anything. You slap the name on anything and people will go absolutely nuts. Walt would be proud. You can see what im saying when you hear people talk about “Cars” or “Rataouille” its like they cant bring them self’s to say, ok it was average, they still have to come back to how great Pixar is.
Jul 8th, 2008
John
Hey Bruce,
You said:
““Cars” or “Rataouille” its like they cant bring them self’s to say, ok it was average”
Says who? You?
Sorry man, but when the absolute lowest critically rated film they’ve got is 75% and every other one is 90% or higher, that pretty much justifies me saying they’re 9 for 9.
You don’t agree? That’s cool, but that’s just your opinion… like everyone else’s.
Jul 8th, 2008
Eric
The whole Antz vs. Bug’s Life is a huge issue. Jeffrey Katzenberg worked in the Disney Feature Animation department and played a huge part getting Toy Story approved with the Disney exec’s. Once Katzenberg got fired from Disney, he got bitter, started Dreamworks and vowed that Dreamworks would take down Disney. John Lassater (on of Pixar’s exec’s and an amazing director) was talking to Katzenberg about ‘bug’s life’ and Katzenberg stole their idea and created Antz as sort of a revenge movie on Disney.
that being said, bugs life wasn’t my favorite, but i think ‘bugs life’s’ success says a lot about pixar. (btw, i got this info from a new book ‘A Pixar Touch’ by David Price, a good read if you want info about how Pixar started and such..)
Jul 8th, 2008
Bruce
@ John
Well if you going to quote percentages, then il say the majority of reviews and blogs discussion at the time of those films displayed alot of negative and mixed feedback. Of course this is all opinion, but popular opinion can be also used which is what i said about “Cars”. You say nine for nine, but i dont imagine anyone over the age of ten going to put “A Bugs life” in there dvd player for some quality entertainment. To me what your saying sounds like when someone states they love “Star wars” but then goes on to say the newer ones are just ok, or when some one says “Back to the future” is an awesome trilogy when even though it inst fact most people would agree that the third one is a massive let down in terms of what to see. John, can you honestly tell me you love “Cars” and “A bugs life” that much? keeping in mind that you think all there films are nine for nine and that you believe Pixars is the greatest movie studio period?
Jul 8th, 2008
Bagger
I’d say that Toy Story and A Bug’s Lifeare by your logic more “adult” movies than “Cars”, John, which was in my opinion a piece of s…
Toy Story deal with themes of losing a secured friend base, and (like the Incredibles) of losing ones importance to society.
A Bug’s Life deals with themes of the fairness and purpose of labour. Something adults should relate to far more than children. Altough to be fair the themes never really become more sophisticated that what could essentially have been a slightly-rewritten communist myth. And yes, they sort of ripped “Seven Samurai”, but no worse than The Incredibles ripped “Watchmen”.
I’d say “the Incredibles” is in effect the furthest they have moved away from “kid movies”. Because the action (and characters) of the story is, as opposed to say “Cars”, so distanced from what is usually connected with “kid movies”.
I also have to disagree on your opinion of “Shrek”. Shrek is, and for more reasons than just the adult humor, at least as mature as the average Pixar movie.
Jul 9th, 2008
Edvin
Movievampire I totally agree with you.
Remember guys these are “Family” Movies, that are mostly geared towards children, early teens.
I mean you wouldn’t call The Never Ending Story an adult movie with things for children.
It’s a hardboiled family movies, with some very dark themes for children.
And btw you guys are toally underestemating childrens abilty to get some of these things you find ooooh soooo deep.
It’s just amazing how adults forget how it was to be a child and always asume that children are a little… well simple…
Jul 9th, 2008
Iain "DDude" Dawson
The thing that I hate about this whole discussion is the argument that since you become an adult you must reject all the things that you loved when you where a child, and embrace more adult things. Pixar creates a level where you do not alienate the children, and yet the honesty of their pictures allows them to bring their messages in greater clarity to the adults.
I loved Ratatouille. It was a film about a rat. Who can cook. That is a premise that puts off many adults, and that is a key problem for pixar.
Jul 9th, 2008
Iain "DDude" Dawson
(not that you where suggesting that adults have to reject childhood things, but that is what I face if I ever suggest to people, “hey should we go watch Wall.E?”)
Jul 9th, 2008
Darren J Seeley
I echo Mez up there…“Shrek” a “specific kid movie” John??
No, I go with ‘Kid Friendly’ on the first Shrek. The two sequels were not friendly to anyone, BTW.
******
I for one would love to see another studio roll the dice on something like ‘Final Fantasy: Spirits Within” or get better distribution for anime (and I DON’T mean Pokemon or stuff that is an 80 minute commercial for what to get the kids for Christmas) but alas, when it comes to animation, it seems a studio is more content with stuff like “Space Chimps” (?) than a animation film like ‘Cowboy Bebop’ about seven years ago.
******
Jul 9th, 2008
Thos
Ok, so maybe Pixar should just dish out a Heavy Metal film rated NC-17 to lose the “kids only” rap. Whatever…
Jul 9th, 2008
parker
I agree with movie vampire, a movie geared toward kids is … a kid movie. And yes I like kid movies, except cars, which was pretty awful.
And Final Fantasy the spirits within was awful, but if your looking for a good final fantasy film you will find it with Final Fantasy: Advent Children, that movie was pretty good.
Jul 9th, 2008
George
out on the blogs and in film fandom in general the consensus always seems to be cars is not very good and generally disliked by a lot of film fans. I happen to like it but it is the only Pixar film that you always see getting a hard time by almost everyone.
Jul 9th, 2008
alfie
For me they consistantly make great films. but I do think some of them get over rated. Toy Story and Toy Story 2 are the only genuine for the ages classics as far as I am concerned. Thats not to say the others are not great but lets face it ratatouille and monsters inc are not going to remembered as classic pieces of animation history in 20 years time. Wall-E might. Its a fucking gem but for me only the two toy story films are for the ages.
But I can honestly say I like all of their films - even cars.
Jul 10th, 2008
y
you sound like a nerd explaining the difference between a dwarf and a leprechaun, lol
Jul 10th, 2008
Sirec
I agree fully with john in everything he has said. I personally cannot stand dreamworks and anyone else that has attempted animation since pixar became the giant within the animation business. I mean, everything from the fact that the movies are great all around for parents and children, pixar has so many more things going for them. I mean, this was a company that if I remember correctly was sold by Disney and now realizing that they themselves have no way of competing with pixar had to buy them back is major in itself. The king of children movies, rebuying a company they sold? Wow,
Second, pixar is a 9 for 9 or if you want to get super critical, fine 81/2 out of 9. Cars was the worst of the pixar movies but a good movie none the less. They have also won an oscar for best animated film for almost every film they have created ( I believe bugs life and cars were the two who did not win, please correct me if I’m wrong) but the critics that I read, from Ebert to Rotten Tomatoes have not had anything bad to say about the films for quite some time now. And when not one, but now two movies have been strongly considered for outside oscars then just best animation that is going a long way to show how amazing the company is at making a “film” as well. IT almost seems that Pixar, even though they are a majorly huge movie company now, are making movies sparringly and not just “pumping” them out like someone like dreamworks, they pick movies they know people will enjoy as a family and just as yourself as well. I conclude that I enjoyed this article very much and that I support anyone else that agrees with my opinions and John’s that Pixar is quite possibly the best all around movie studio around today.
Jul 11th, 2008
Jamie
Never thought of it that way, but now i think about it i remember seeing alot of laughing adults at shrek.
Jul 16th, 2008
Gordon
From some of these comments, I have to wonder how many of you know anything much about filmmaking?
Compare Pixar’s nine films with the most recent nine films of any kind from any studio and see how they match up. Pixar remains on top of its game when other studios aren’t even certain what game they’re in.
Jul 18th, 2008
Davis
So, let me see if I understand. If someone disagrees with John, who agrees with critics’ opinions, it’s just that person’s opinion. Yet, since John has more opinions that agree with his opinion, John’s opinion is the uberopinion that trumps all others. This is why I generally dislike bloggers.
Jul 18th, 2008
Gordon
Ah …so you are filled with self loathing?
Jul 18th, 2008
sanjoy alexander
the creativity involved in the conception and making of animated movies are indeed fascinating…
Jul 22nd, 2008
Teri m Talbot
I disagree with the article writer. Sure pixar makes movies with kid content but claiming Shrek, Kung fu Panda and madagascar are kid movies is laughable. All the adult themes you point out in pixar are also found in other films. Also they are 9 of 9 i agree but in that same time period i can fine 9 movies from any of the big publishers that made more money. Critic Scores are complete hogwash as are awards since they are completly biased opinions. only rating you should go by is the box office.
Jul 25th, 2008
steve
(Type your comment here. Make sure you’ve read the commenting rules before doing so)Guys, A Bug’s Life was great. Looking back we forget the context this movie was released in. (Young people today watch Star Wars and don’t understand how it affected everything, there were no movie action figures before, for Heaven’s sake. Bug’s life was no star wars, but it had animated “outtakes and deleted sences”. brilliant. It isn’t Pixar’s best, but it is a good movie by any standard.
Also, I don’t think John is suggesting that Pixar is 9 for 9 and they’re all Godfather quality, but they’re all qaulity. The point is that they are consistently high quality. You throw one hundred darts you’re bound to be on target occasionally, but the guy who’s darn close 9 outta 9 is better. period.
Jul 28th, 2008
Richard Raucci
This is a pretty good article on the difference between kid movies and movies that work on many different levels, but also work for kids.
See this list on UnSpun for an idea of what people think “best children’s movies” are: http://unspun.amazon.com/The-Best-Childrens-Movies-Ever/list/show/21253
I was surprised to see that Pixar movies didn’t dominate the list. However, films like The Neverending Story did - showing that the original article’s claim that movies with a storyline that works for adults does work for kids, too.
Aug 19th, 2008
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